# Interest group forums > Electrical Contracting Industry Forum > Electrical Load Shedding Forum >  And the lights go out again.

## Dave A

Out of the blue, power shedding. Not a hint of a looming problem and then bang, the lights go out.




> Power cuts rippled across South Africa on Thursday, blacking out parts of major cities and spurring warnings from state utility Eskom that unexpected shortages could extend into next week.
> 
> The cuts, which Eskom attributed to power-station maintenance and the shutdown of one unit at the country's only nuclear power plant, caused power failures stretching from Cape Town to Johannesburg.
> 
> South Africa's power woes have raised political temperatures in the past, with critics accusing the government of failing to address the energy crunch plaguing Africa's biggest economy as it gears up to host the Soccer World Cup in 2010.
> 
> Minister of Public Enterprises Alec Erwin was "confident that South Africa as a whole will not be plunged into darkness", said a statement from his office.
> 
> Eskom spokesperson Fani Zulu said the company would try to ensure that a 2 000MW shortage would not take a heavy toll on homes and appealed to the public to switch off non-essential electrical equipment.
> ...

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## Dave A

First National Bank (FNB) is to spend R50-million on standby generators and uninterrupted power supply (UPS) units at its branches nationwide in response to power failures, it said on Friday.

FNB said about R15,5-million [of the total amount] had already gone towards generators at 63 branches.

An additional 32 would be installed from March at a cost of about R8-million, putting FNB's total investment in generators at R24-million by June this year.

Generators have an average power supply of 220 kilowatts each, and would be able to keep a full-service branch running, including air-conditioning, computers, servers, routers and ATMs which consume huge chunks of power, FNB said.
full story from M&G here

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## Snoopy_inc

If anyone wants a UPS or generator... pm me i know where to get them cheapish.

One thing i have to tell you... our clients that are power people... are MAKING SO MUCH MONEY its frightning.

Anyway on this issue im going to post a very long and intensive quote from wellinformed.co.za
Bear with me




> JOHANNESBURG (Reuters) - South Africa, the continent's economic powerhouse, faces nationwide power cuts that could last into next week, a spokesman for state utility Eskom said on Thursday.
> 
> Fani Zulu said the company would try to ensure that a 2,000 megawatt shortage would not take a heavy toll on homes and appealed to the public to switch off non-essential electrical equipment.
> 
> An unexpected surge in demand came as maintenance was being carried out at power stations, said Zulu.
> 
> "The situation is critical. We expect about two hours of shortages a day. We will tap reserve resources. Hopefully we will resolve the problem early next week," he said.
> 
> "We will pull out all stops to make sure that electricity is distributed evenly and there will be no need for lower supplies in some areas."
> ...





> Updates:
> 
> Koeberg 'trips': Eskom issues national power alert
> 
> Eskom will conduct load-shedding "equitably" throughout the country, the power utility said on Thursday.
> 
> The parastatal's regional centres would have information on which areas would be affected and when.
> 
> Spokesperson Tony Stott said there would also be information on the Eskom website.
> ...





> Update
> 
> No load shedding is anticipated for the week, but in case the situation should call for load shedding (which Eskom does not anticipate), the following guidelines for load shedding schedules will be applicable :
> Southern Region - Green Scenario   Orange Scenario   Red Scenario
> 
> Eastern Region - All Scenarios
> Northern Region - All Scenarios
> 
> Western Region  (Western Cape)  -  Green Scenario    Orange Scenario     Red Scenario
> ...


And finally from a member




> Ok, we all know Eskom has screwed up bigtime and is simply taking to long with the pebble beds, etc, etc. But should we not make a public effort to help Eskom? Eskom is after all delivering electricity to us at the world's LOWEST price.
> 
> Saving power will not only help Eskom, it also means you will fork out even less money for electricity.
> 
> Help Eskom Help Yourself and read this:
> http://www.eskom.co.za/customers/ele...y_content.html



Hope this provides some insight and info into the matter.

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## Dave A

More blackouts may be on the way after Eskom warned South Africans yesterday evening that it was short of 6 500 megawatts because up to 15 of its electricity generating units were down.

This warning, following blackouts a fortnight ago, underlines the precarious position facing the economy until Eskom's capital expenditure plan begins to add capacity.

Andrew Etzinger, Eskom's general manager of investment strategy, said yesterday: "We have eaten into our normal operating margin of 1 600MW", meaning that the situation was tight. 

To prevent load shedding, Eskom appealed to businesses and consumers to conserve electricity.

In its statement Eskom said: "Currently the risk of load shedding is low. However, if additional generating plant goes on unplanned outage, the possibility of load shedding will increase and, if necessary, load shedding will be done on a rotational basis."

Eskom has a net capacity of 36 398MW, but with only 29 898MW now available it cannot meet the average demand of between 30 000MW and 31 000MW.
full story from Business Report here

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## duncan drennan

California is in the process of bringing in legislation to ban incandescent bulbs.

Practical, relatively simple to do, huge energy saving over the country, why doesn't the government just ban incandescents, and subsidize CFLs? Probably take about 6 months for them to filter in (as incandescents break), then Eskom wins.

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## Chris Bouwer

I lived down the south coast for a few years (Port Edward) and the blackouts were common place.
Eskom were using old equipment that could't cope with demand.
Has Eskom not planned properly?????????
Demand has grown at a helluva rate and they get caught with their pants down!

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## Dave A

And the real reason behind our electricity supply woes comes out.



> Electricity supply in South Africa will remain uncertain for the next five years, with a reserve margin of just over half of what it should be, Parliament's public enterprises portfolio committee heard on Wednesday.
> 
> Briefing members of Parliament, Anton Eberhard, a professor at the University of Cape Town's Graduate School of Business, said one of the main reasons for this was a 2001 Cabinet decision not to allow Eskom to build new generating capacity at that time.
> 
> "It's clear ... that South Africa's security of supply is inadequate ... the root cause was ... policy uncertainty and the prohibition on Eskom building new capacity. A Cabinet memo in 2001 actually prevented Eskom from building [new generating plants], and we had this critical period between 2001 and 2004 where there was this hiatus.
> 
> "The expectation was that private power would come in. In fact nothing was done to facilitate that ... it's not so much that the policy was basically wrong; the policy wasn't actually implemented.
> 
> "So the legislation wasn't in place, the contracting, the competitive tenders, all those necessary steps to get private sector in, didn't happen in that period," he said.
> full story from M&G here

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## Dave A

I see the lights are going out again. Power shedding is happening all over.




> Eskom has been caught napping again and has caused massive disruption to the public and the economy, the Democratic Alliance said on Wednesday.
> 
> "Eskom has informed the public too late about load shedding and has caused massive disruptions," said DA spokesperson on Minerals and Energy Affairs, Hendrik Schmidt.
> 
> He said power failures were costing the economy up to R8-billion a year, and that the costs were not only measurable in financial terms.
> 
> "Yesterday [Tuesday] in Eshowe and Shallcross, learners had their matric typing exams interrupted, requiring the paper to be reset by the KwaZulu-Natal education department, and the exam to be postponed to a later date.
> 
> "This morning [Wednesday], traffic lights not working caused pandemonium in various areas in Johannesburg. DA representatives in Port Elizabeth reported that elderly pensioners throughout the city were left queuing in the wet and the cold at pension points that were not working due to a lack of electricity."
> ...


Once again, welcome to darker Africa.

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## Dave A

Another round of powershedding yesterday. Our site seems to be on the 4.00pm to 6.00pm shift.

And then I get home and one of the overhead power supply lines had dropped out of its connector box. I must say I was pretty pleased to see the guy from eThekwini Municipality arrive to fix the problem, even if it was at midnight last night.

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## Dave A

Just checking the news headlines. And find this




> Stott said South Africans need to be aware that load shedding is a reality to deal with for the next few years. "[Load shedding] is not short-term until we construct large power stations." said Stott. "Demand and supply are very tight."
> 
> Load shedding could continue for the next five to seven years. During this time, Eskom is looking at various sources of energy. New gas turbines are to be built and a coal power plant is to be completed in 2012, he said.
> full story from M&G here


Oh boy  :Frown:

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## duncan drennan

If you are looking for info about the load shedding schedules and the current load shedding schedule you can check out http://www.poweralert.co.za

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## Dave A

I see Cape Town isn't taking Eskom's 5-7 year plan lying down.



> The City of Cape Town says it has asked for a top-level meeting with Eskom over power cuts and their threat to new investments. The request comes in the wake of an announcement by the utility that South Africa faces another five to seven years of electricity failures.
> 
> Mayoral committee member for economic development Simon Grindrod said on Thursday he has asked to meet Eskom chief executive Jacob Maroga to discuss the effects of blackouts and load shedding.
> 
> Grindrod said he is concerned at the implications for economic growth and development in the wider Cape Town region.
> 
> He said there is unprecedented interest in the city in terms of development and investment enquiries, but there is still no clarity on Eskom's ability to provide a stable electricity supply.
> 
> "It is the number-one question asked by potential investors in terms of investing in the manufacturing and industrial sector," he said. "We need to be able to give them a straight answer. It is no good telling investors that normal service will be available in five to seven years. 
> ...

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## Dave A

AAARRGHHHH! Bl**dy power shedding  :Mad: 

Sorry. Just had to let that rip.

Feel slightly better now.

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## Graeme

Shut down one aluminium smelter and the problrm is solved.  The govt knew what was coming, and yet gave a clearance for yet another smelter.

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## Dave A

It simply has to be bad planning. This whole "we did not anticipate x,y & z happening" is not an excuse, it's an admission of incompetence.

I recall one time when the excuse was the coal was wet because of rain. How unexpected. Is rain such an unusual occurrence that it wasn't factored into the master management plan?

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## duncan drennan

Did anyone see the quick interview with Eskom's CEO on eNews last night?

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## Dave A

I didn't, but my brother said Thabo was on TV saying "Don't blame Escom. It is the government's fault."

Apparently, Escom *did* go to government in good time and say we were heading for a problem, and government ignored it because at the time Escom was still mothballing stations.

I know this - I feel like I've had my dose of loadshedding this week.
Monday 2-4 pm at my offices (Durban).
Tuesday 10-12 am at a meeting (Pretoria).
Wednesday (today) 2-4 pm at my offices (Durban) again.

It's getting beyond a joke.

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## Dave A

Here's confirmation of the Mbeki apology, and a bit more besides.



> Constant power cuts are darkening the mood among South Africans, with President Thabo Mbeki admitting that the government was at fault for ignoring growing energy needs.
> 
> Africa's largest economy is buckling under energy pressures after failing to heed pleas by state power utility Eskom to invest more in electricity generation to keep up with the country's growth.
> 
> "We said not now, later. We were wrong. Eskom was right. We were wrong," Mbeki said in a rare public apology during a speech on Tuesday night.
> 
> To some the power cuts are a mere annoyance while small businesses lose money and some -- like the owner of a popular South African ice-cream brand -- face financial disaster when energy giant Eskom tightens its straining energy belt.
> 
> A booming post-apartheid economy, and scant regard for energy efficiency as South Africans lavishly squander electricity at the cheapest rates in the world, are some of the reasons Huberto Stempowski now has to find another way to chill his ice-cream.
> ...

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## Chatmaster

Is there a practical way of running your entire household and office on solar power, anybody knows anything about the possibilities? I am seriously considering getting self sustained with electricity...

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## duncan drennan

> Is there a practical way of running your entire household and office on solar power, anybody knows anything about the possibilities? I am seriously considering getting self sustained with electricity...


You certainly can....but it is VERY expensive (and I still have some doubts as to the eco-friendliness of solar photovoltaic panels).

A 200W panel costs about R9000. Desktop PC can be anywhere from 150-500W, laptops are usually under 90W (depending on what you have in it). You would probably also have to look at your lighting and what could work. 

Personally I would want at least 1kW for a small home office (2 computers)...and that is R45k worth of solar panels  :EEK!: 

Oh yes, 200W panel is about 1.8m x 0.6m

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## Dave A

Then there are the batteries and inverter.

With this looking like a long term issue, I'm seriously considering installing a backup generator setup for my office. Computers, telephone system and lights, I think. The cost in downtime is really starting to add up.

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## Chatmaster

Yep, I think I would rather go with a generator as well. 

dsd, why is there an issue with regards to the eco-friendlinesses of solar panels?

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## Dave A

Eskom has failed to get the big price hike they were hoping for. Although the approved increase of 14.2% is still well above the inflation target range.




> Electricity parastatal Eskom has failed to secure permission to hike annual tariffs by 18% after the National Energy Regulator (Nersa) on Thursday ruled that it may only implement a price increase of 14,2%. 
> 
> Nersa said that the rule changes applied for by Eskom in April had been declined. 
> 
> Eskom had requested that it be allowed to increase tariffs by 18,7% during the 2008/09 financial year to maintain effective operations following a steep increase in its input costs of coal and the need to finance capital expenditure.
> full story from M&G here

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## duncan drennan

> dsd, why is there an issue with regards to the eco-friendlinesses of solar panels?


I need to do a bit of research to find out what the latest info is. About 5 years ago I spoke to a guy that did some research with solar panels, and he was quite dissillusioned as, at that time, the amount of energy required to manufacture a solar panel was more than it produced in it's entire lifetime.

I do need to find out if the current panels are better, but you do have to take into account manufacturing energy.

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## Dave A

With this thread in mind, I took a moment to get some details on my parent's solar electricity system whilst visiting over Christmas.

It's a 24 volt system and each 0.5 metre square panel produces 100 watts.

It wasn't much use talking about costs - they've had the system long enough that I'm sure the cost at the time would no longer be relevant nowadays.

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## entoserv

> Eskom has failed to get the big price hike they were hoping for. Although the approved increase of 14.2% is still well above the inflation target range.


How is inflation ever going to go down if government keeps approving these big increases? Has government kept *any* increase below 6% lately?

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## Dave A

I was driving back to the office after a bit of wandering about. The 2.00 pm news bulletin on Radio 5 was not full of good cheer.

Eskom has asked for bids on a new nuclear power station - with hopes to get started in 2010 and completion by 2016.

Also, load shedding is expected all of this week. But how about this. Apparently people suffering load shedding once a day is not enough anymore. Some areas will be switched off for two hours twice a day now.

The problem is getting worse. Much worse. And I couldn't help but think of this post:



> Shut down one aluminium smelter and the problem is solved.  The govt knew what was coming, and yet gave a clearance for yet another smelter.


Are we still aggressively expanding the grid in the midst of this power shortage?
Surely new projects with a heavy draw *have* to be put on hold until we've got the power to carry them.

It was bad enough when you could expect a load shed in your area every couple of days. Now they're talking some areas twice a day! I expect that means virtually everyone can expect an interruption at least once a day.

What happened? A new smelter come online?

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## Chatmaster

Yep, Krugersdorp is down atm for the 2nd time today, that means 4 hours of productivity, gone. I need a serious question answered. I need to run 3 pc's, printer/fax and 2 notebooks. I need to buy a generator now. What sort of generator or solutions can you guys suggest?

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## duncan drennan

What type of printer, laser of inkjet?

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## Chatmaster

Inkjet!
Ok, this is really serious now. My losses for the day is in access of 15k. The electricity is off now for 2 and a half hours. That is excluding this morning's 2 hours. I am going to look for a generator right away. To buy it for 2k or 3k is now really worth while.

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## duncan drennan

The exact requirements will depend a bit on your specific PC's and their uses....but this is what I would guess...

3x PC @ 200W = 600W (depending on usage/configuration this could range anywhere from 150W - 500W)
1x inkjet printer @ 50W
2x notebooks @ 90W = 180W
3x monitors @ 50W = 150W (for LCD's, about 150W/CRT)

So that totals 980W. Build in some extra, and I would guess you need about 1.5 - 2kW to be safe and happy. 1kW will be a bit on the edge (make sure the wattage is enough, as they often advertise the kVA's).

What I do is run everything off a UPS, and then if the power goes off, unplug the UPS and then plug the ups into the generator (that way you also won't have any surprises when the power comes back on). When it comes back on just move it back to the mains.

Watch out for generators, they can have very unstable outputs (depends on the model/price), which is one of the reasons I prefer to run through a UPS, which will make sure the power the PC's see is stable.

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## Chatmaster

Well we just had our 3rd outage for the day...  :Rant1: 
Duncan how much are we talking about for a UPS and a 2kw generator. These guys are going to see me a mile of and I do not want to pay more than it is worth.

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## Dave A

5 kVA should handle that and a fair bit besides. It's kinda a handy size.

I once bought a 2.2 kVA petrol generator - it's very frustrating because it's too sensitive to load.

Go diesel if you can. They're a little more stable running.

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## Chatmaster

Well, I did some research on the UPS's. Man am I completely lost. I have no idea what any of the descriptions mean. Exactly how long can a UPS last and what should I look for?

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## Dave A

If you've got a generator - as long as it takes for you to switch over  :Big Grin: 

I'm going to be running around doing some investigation on the subject myself tomorrow. I'll post what I find. Things are clearly going to get worse before they get better.

I've also set up a category for electrical load shedding information websites in the links manager. I've loaded the ones I've found so far. Add any you might find along the way too.

No luck for Joburg so far  :Frown:

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## murdock

all i can say is thank goodness i live were i do...we are not affected by load shedding yet....and thumbs up for the old goverment...thank you for building such a good power grid that it has this long...i dont know what we a going to do in the future... news today....they dont know if the budget is going to allow for the power stations because of the falling rand????? zimbabwe her ewe come.

anyone looking for a standby generator email me on:

electricalpowersolutions@gmail.com

some ideas

get small battery backup light fittings which last at least 3 hours which is connected directly to the power so that you dont get caught with flat batteries...
ups to run home computor tv and sensitive electronic equipment (because these cheap generators will destroy your equipment in time...even with AVR...
solar powered geyser...gas stove even a portable one just to heat water cook eggs etc you dont need an oven..use the microwave or buy a gas webber and of course dont forget to fill the gas bottles.
and a small generator to keep the ups charged run your fridge and deep freeze...which is not nessary if you dont keep opening the doors...keep frozen 2 lt bottes in the deep freeze and put in the fridge if an when required....

load shedding is a reality start planning your life around it...or keep getting caught in the dark...the light at the end of the tunnel is dimming...generator companies are making millions.

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## duncan drennan

> Duncan how much are we talking about for a UPS and a 2kw generator. These guys are going to see me a mile of and I do not want to pay more than it is worth.


I'm really not too sure. I would shop around a bit, and see what is out there. Prices seem to vary dramatically. Try contacting Bundu Power, and see what they can offer you.

Here is Makro's price list for generators.

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## duncan drennan

> load shedding is a reality start planning your life around it...or keep getting caught in the dark...the light at the end of the tunnel is dimming...generator companies are making millions.


That is the truth! The key issue here is to figure out how we can each make some small but significant changes which will have a lasting impact. Obviously the benefit for businesses of changing to lower power technologies, or saving energy where they can would be felt by all.

For example, just making sure that your computers are set to run on the lowest power possible will make a difference.

Some tips for computers:

Turn your screen saver off, and rather set your monitor to power down after 10-15 minutes of non use.Set your computer's power management to "Minimal power mangement" (you will maintain performance, but when the cpu is not busy it will go into a lower power state). Here is how to manage power on Windows Vista.Set your computer to sleep and/or hibernate after some period (then you can save power while not at your desk.Choose a computer from the Climate Savers Computing product list.Use a laptop if possible (they are generally a lower power option, but it depends on your needs).

By making the power management, screen off, sleep and hibernate changes to all the computers in your organisation you can make a significant savings in power. If all organisations do it the effect would be noticeable.

*So ask yourself, "How many PCs are sitting idling for most of the day wasting electricity in my building?"* Then take 10 minutes out of your day to fix it.

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## Dave A

We got load shed from 2-4pm yesterday and 8-10am today. The economics of putting in backup power generation is now officially beyond dispute for us.

I've just come back from Makro. They've got a 5.5 kVA petrol generator at R5 999.00 and a really sweet 6 kVA diesel for R12 000.00 - both have automatic voltage regulation (AVR) so they should provide a fairly clean electrical supply.

The 6kVA diesel looks identical to the 5kVA diesel shown on the Bundu Power website in case anyone is in the mood for comparative shopping. I don't have the patience for that kind of messing around right now. I need my solution in now - or at least by the next load shedding scheduled for our area tomorrow afternoon.

You might want to move fairly quickly. Makro Springfield alone sold R400 000.00 in generators yesterday.

I haven't got to checking out the UPS situation yet. Once I've tested the quality of the supply off the generator I'll know whether we really need one (or more). I might just get a UPS for our server anyway.

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## Chatmaster

I gave Bundu power a call. It looks like I will be going for the 2600 petrol model. Because I do workshops I will need to have something that fits in my car. I certainly cannot have a power failure while doing a workshop,lol They go for R4950. I think that is worth the price. I also decided that instead of buying a UPS I will rather upgrade my Notebooks and use it full time. My daughter Just scored a AMD 64 Athlon, lol

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## Dave A

We've been sourcing a cross-over switch at the moment.

Just a warning for the do-it-yourself types that comes from one conversation today - *Do not connect your generator into your exsisting installation* - When the power comes back on - one fried generator.

And I know some bright spark is going to say - "But if I switch off the mains isolator?"
You need an interlocked cross-over switch to make sure there is absolutely no way the mains power can reach the generator. Period.

It takes proper equipment and some planning to hook a generator into your existing electrical installation. For goodness sake, if that is what you want, get it done by an electrician!

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## Chatmaster

Well despite the Eskom website stating we will have no power cuts today, the power went off as I closed their website. It resulted into me spending R4500 on a portable Ryobi 650w and a Ryobi 2700 from Mica. Tomorrow I will be prepared and hopefully back in business.

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## duncan drennan

A question here for the electricians....

Generators have a ground terminal, does that have to be connected to a reasonable ground for safety purposes? If so, what is the best way to do this? What could happen if it is not connected?

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## murdock

from my experience dealing with power issues...my first choice would be an online UPS for all sensitive electronic equipment then a generator to run the UPS.

the connection you are talking about is promoted at places like makro i was listening to the fella selling generators at makro explaining to someone how to connect plug to plug...we call it a suicide cord because if you forget to switch off your main switch you could kill an electrician working on the line...depending on the impedance of the generator it might not blow up when the power comes back on it might just catch on fire...just remeber there is no circuit protection for you or your family if you connect it this way.

you need to connect the generator  earth to the generator neutral as close to the generator as possible...and some people advise to put an earth spike just because it would be the closest route to ground...but there are a lot of debates going on about this...bottom line there are no regulations for generators at the moment only guidelines.

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## Dave A

Surely the mains supply earth is not being isolated in the power-down? 

If we stick to the main earth safety strategy (no floating earths), I'd expect the best thing would be to connect the generator's earth to the main supply earth. Bridge neutral and earth at or near the generator if it isn't bridged in the generator circuitry already and mission accomplished.

Something else for me to bug my guys about tomorrow morning  :Whistling: 
They're the ones who have been doing our backup generator installs.

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## Dave A

Aaargh! Serious backlog on supplies of the cross-over switch. My guys are building some contactor based box for the job now.

Power going down at 2.00pm - install time!

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## Chatmaster

I must say, I am very happy with my Ryobi RG 950, 650w. Had to test it this morning and it was working really well. I had my AMD 64 Athlon, 19" screen, Speakers and the fan on, no problem!

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## Chatmaster

So my wife said she wanted coffee and I thought I should investigate how much electricity a kettle would use. Well I eventually found this article on the kestrel site giving approximate electricity usage for appliances and more. It seems I will have to use the big boy for the kettle alone, lol

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## IanF

> So my wife said she wanted coffee and I thought I should investigate how much electricity a kettle would use. Well I eventually found this article on the kestrel site giving approximate electricity usage for appliances and more. It seems I will have to use the big boy for the kettle alone, lol


Chatmaster,
Easy solution just drink a cold beer or juice. Coffee is bad for you  :Smile:

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## Chatmaster

> Chatmaster,
> Easy solution just drink a cold beer or juice. Coffee is bad for you


lol, I actually do have a fine bottle of nicely aged Grape "juice" in the kitchen, looking for the corkscrew right now!  :Devil2:

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## Dave A

I see Eskom is calling for a halt on new electricity hungry development.



> Eskom says South Africa should be closed for new big industrial projects at least until 2013, when electricity supply is expected to improve.
> 
> Bongani Nqwababa, Eskom's finance director, said yesterday that the parastatal had advised the government that it wanted South Africa marketed only from 2013 for both local and foreign projects. It was inappropriate to advertise South Africa as an investment destination with low-cost electricity. "You don't sell what you don't have."
> 
> He warned that the Rio Tinto Alcan aluminium smelter in the Coega industrial development zone could be delayed. "Eskom needs to review supply to Coega." Other projects, such as BHP Billiton's plans to expand, were on the back burner.
> 
> When Eskom and Alcan had signed a 25-year power supply agreement in November 2006, both made commitments that, if reneged on, would incur penalties. Nqwababa said: "There must be penalties [but] I am sure they are cheaper than building a power station."
> from Business Report here


So the Coega smelter is on hold - or maybe not as this report suggests:



> Despite electricity blackouts, Rio Tinto Alcan is looking to give the go-ahead on South Africa's largest greenfields project, the Coega aluminium smelter, by mid-year, after receiving assurances from Eskom that it will be able to power the project starting in late 2010.
> 
> Robert Valdmanis, a Rio Tinto spokesperson, said yesterday that the engineering study was expected to be completed before the end of June. 
> 
> Aluminium smelters are Eskom's largest energy consumers. At 1 350 megawatts, the Coega smelter will use about 3.5 percent of Eskom's available power capacity while the utility will battle to supply its other industrial and municipal customers.
> from Business Report here

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## duncan drennan

Maybe it is just me, but this all just looks like a HUGE opportunity for the right people.

Anyone have a way of halving the energy required for an aluminium smelter?

Anyone have a way of providing at least half of that energy quickly and efficiently?

There is a huge industry that is about to boom in South Africa, and that is energy efficiency and self-provisioning. Where do you think people are going to invest capital if they can't build new plants?

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## Chatmaster

Just listened to a very interesting discussion on radio. One of the big lions at Eskom said that solar power are being subsidized by Eskom. I just wonder by how much... If I understood correctly you are talking at least 70k to convert your entire house to solar power.

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## Dave A

> I gave Bundu power a call. It looks like I will be going for the 2600 petrol model.


It looks like you got there in time. I'm trying to source a generator for a client at the moment and called Bundu Power. Next shipment due in 6-8 weeks.

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## Debbiedle

Heard yesterday on 567 Cape Talk that China supply power to their factories for 4 days a week, responsibility for the other 3 days lie with the factory.  In certain areas of India there is load shedding with factories adjusting by having "Sunday" on Friday and thereby sharing the load more evenly.  This problem is here to stay, we have simply expanded too rapidly and the powers that be (hahaha punny!)  didn't see it coming!

So what can we do to provide our own power?  What can we do to save power?  How can we help Eskom and the nation?   Oh yes, me thinks water is next by the way!  Polokwane put a moratorium on all development towards the end of last year for this very reason.  Apparantly (and this is unsubstantiated) the water rights for their supply dam were sold to a nearby mine!

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## Dave A

> In certain areas of India there is load shedding with factories adjusting by having "Sunday" on Friday and thereby sharing the load more evenly.


That is certainly a *very* interesting idea! We definitely are going to have to think out the box.

Historically, we've been quite an inventive nation. I'm quite interested to see what bright new ideas might come out of this challenge.

The water problem has been predicted for a while, particularly for Gauteng. It's always just being a matter of time before it really bites. That said, the topic seems to have been pretty quiet the last year or so. Good rains, I think.



> Apparently (and this is unsubstantiated) the water rights for their supply dam were sold to a nearby mine!


_Somebody_ deserves to get their tail kicked if that is true!

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## Chatmaster

> It looks like you got there in time. I'm trying to source a generator for a client at the moment and called Bundu Power. Next shipment due in 6-8 weeks.


I spoke to their head office here in Jhb, they still had stock. 011 397 7373

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## Chatmaster

Oh yes, forgot to mention. I saw this pamflet from Game, they have a current special on generators to, a nice 2600kw for R2600. Maybe that can help?.

702 had a chat with a Labour Consultant about the factories idea. According to him the idea raised about factories changing their hours to night shift i not realistic and will cause major labour issues. Employees will simply not be willing to change their hours. Then there is security, transport and other issues he mentioned as well.

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## Dave A

Obviously I made the mistake of calling their KZN agent because it is needed in Durban.
Thanks Chatmaster. I'll pass the message on.

(Not a particularly good reflection on their KZN agent)

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## Debbiedle

> 702 had a chat with a Labour Consultant about the factories idea. According to him the idea raised about factories changing their hours to night shift i not realistic and will cause major labour issues. Employees will simply not be willing to change their hours. Then there is security, transport and other issues he mentioned as well.


Yup, the solution is going to need huge buy in from ALL concerned, I wonder if South Africans are up to it?

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## Dave A

Here's a proposed solution that had me chuckling a little bit:



> Faizel Royker, an optometrist at Spectacle Select in Vangate Mall, said the blackouts had caused disturbances during consultation times. 
> 
> "Many of the clients refuse to come back to meet with you and in that way revenue is lost," he said. 
> 
> Royker is adamant that Eskom should do its load-shedding at night as opposed to during trading hours.
> 
> "It's crazy; they should put the lights out after midnight when most of the city is expected to be asleep," he said.
> from IOL here


 :Whistling:

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## duncan drennan

> "It's crazy; they should put the lights out after midnight when most of the city is expected to be asleep," he said.


Maybe it would be more practical to only consult at those times?  :Wink:

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## duncan drennan

Does anyone know what changed from the end of last year, to the beginning of this year? Why is it so much worse now? Or does it just feel like more people are being affected?

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## Dave A

Apparently we've already had more load shedding this year than all of last year.

Initially I wondered if something big had come on stream. But nothing like that has been mentioned. I suspect we're experiencing a compound effect of the diminishing surplus in production capacity.
The generators are being pushed harder - increasing the prospects of "unplanned outages" (breakdowns).There is less time available for planned maintenance. Planned maintenance is scheduled for summer anyway in preparation for winter's peak demands.The efficiency difference between 1% surplus and 1% deficit is huge. And the deficit must be significantly bigger than that. 1% could have been dealt with by browning out the system (trimming down the voltage), which they've probably been doing quite a lot before we got to the rolling black-out situation anyway.
According to Solidarity, there is also insufficient skilled manpower to keep up with the rate of repair/maintenance required. With union members within Eskom, they probably have a better idea of that than the media - so I'm inclined to believe them even if we factor in that this also favours their own organisational agenda.

The lack of quantitative numbers coming out is a sign to me that there is something there that wouldn't look good under the harsh light of public scrutiny.

Ultimately, everything is pointing to more demand than this time last year (to be expected) *and* less production.

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## RKS Computer Solutions

Guys, this is a little too late, but I reckon Duncan has done a great job on saving power with your pc's...

I might not be able to help individuals pay much less than advertised pricing on my site, but bulk orders for UPS (Uninterrupted Power Supplies) can be arranged.  Also willing to take some %% off for members of TFSA.

I have tried as far as possible giving estimated time-frames for every UPS on the specific product pages, so at least you can start from there when looking...


*** Offer valid to TFSA members and companies wanting to buy in bulk*

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## Chatmaster

Riaan, how does it work for myself, being in Krugersdorp in terms of delivery? Any additional charges and how long does it take to deliver?

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## RKS Computer Solutions

Roelof, depending on the amount there is a shipping fee, anything above R2500 is free shipping, and Krugersdorp is next day delivery after money is cleared by my bank.

It all depends on how many of which UPS you'd like to order, we can ship nationally as I know you have sites elsewhere than Krugersdorp, these would however be seperate orders for tracking purposes.

No other charges, the price you see on the online shop is the price you pay usually, but the deal for TFSA enitles you to discount purely for being a member here, so will clear that before a final amount can be invoiced.

Any other questions?

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## Chatmaster

I will definitely get back to you on this Riaan. I am currently busy with a lot of major changes within my businesses and once that is sorted and settled I will definitely need some stuff from you.

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## RKS Computer Solutions

Great stuff, anyone else want to take the offer up?  Don't want this thread to dissapear before everyone knows!

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## Dave A

I've bookmarked it for future reference.

I've got to get past financial end of year before I even think about it seriously.

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## Kevin Stubbs

Can anyone advise me on where I can find info on, the cost of using gas to heat bath water compared to electricity.
I spoke to one person that has gas who claims that is a 1/4 of the price and another that claims it is triple the price.
Kevin

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## duncan drennan

With a gas hot water heater you only heat water when it is needed, so there is no cost in keeping the water hot (as with an electric geyser).

Gas costs more per kilowatt (about double if I remember correctly, but don't quote me on that), so it depends a bit on how much water you are using as to whether you will save or not. I *think* that a domestic household will generally save money using a gas hot water heater.

Do take into consideration that gas (LPG) prices are not regulated, and there were a couple of supply issues last year in the winter. Prices can vary dramatically, especially in the middle of the winter.

I guess that they install two 19kg bottles for that type of thing, so you should always have gas, unless you let both run out (one should carry you over if there is a supply issue).

Come to think of it, the supply issues were mainly with 9kg bottles - I was always able to get the bigger sizes.

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