# Regulatory Compliance Category > Consumer Protection Act Forum > [Question] Workshop retaining vehicle after performing unapproved repairs, not even quoted for!

## Darkangelyaya

:Mad:  I need some information please: 
My vehicle broke down and was towed in to the company who replaced most of the engine in June, at a cost of R28 000.00. I saw it as a warranty repair, and the vehicle was towed in to the said workshop, two weeks ago. 

At NO stage was I ever informed that this was NOT going to be repaired under a warranty claim. I called the Owner of the workshop daily for updates. At NO stage whatsoever was I ever informed that the vehicle is being repaired AT MY OWN COST. At NO stage did I receive any quotation, estimate, or information that an estimate will be done once the engine has been opened. I NEVER signed any CPA forms, or gave any written consent at all; I never even telephonically or verbally consented to repairs being done. (I record important phone conversations). 

On Monday, I was informed that they are putting oil in the vehicle and will test it on that day, and that I can then come and fetch it as soon as I have paid the bill. I was blown away, and enquired as to when I actually gave permission for repairs not under warranty, and in fact... where was the quote?!!! I then received the quote, with Monday's date on it - for R 12 000.00.

I have lodged a formal complaint with their Head Office, who referred me to the MIO for arbitration, as the franchise is independantly owned.

The owner, a woman, went into a screaming fit yet again, on the phone today, becoming very abusive, and screaming that 'that f'in vehicle will not go anywhere until it is paid in full'. (Recorded).

They are refusing to hand over my vehicle. 

Surely this is a clear case of violation of my rights under the CPA, and I have the law on my side to fetch my vehicle - the workshop must then decide if they want to proceed with legal action towards recovering 'their money' (Sarcasm is mine)???

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## sterne.law@gmail.com

Regarding retaining possession - this is allowed without a court order as it is a lien. 
It is unclear what you mean by referring to a warranty. Was this an agreed warranty OR is your stance based on the Consumer Protection Act 6 month warranty and your argument is that the repair was a transaction and therefore you believe that you have a 6 month warranty?

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Darkangelyaya (07-Nov-12)

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## Darkangelyaya

Thanks for the reply, Anthony

I have a written warranty printed on the invoice paid in June, when the major repairs were done. It is a six month, or 10 000km warranty on all repairs done as per stated invoice. I am not relying on the CPA alone in this.

However, after getting a number of different legal opinions from different people, I decided to just do it myself, and go and fetch my vehicle. (Actually, I decided this yesterday afternoon after a phonecall during which I was screamed at, sworn at and verbally abused on record by the deceptively well-groomed, 'honest' and 'religious' owner of the workshop)

So I did. (Not great security there.)

I fail to see how the workshop wil react now, since they have NO records of any type, indicating any agreement for repairs on my vehicle.

What is that thing about possession being 9/10ths of the law again...? 
(She did act rather possessed)

Lesson learnt: 'Get everything in writing and record every conversation remotely considered important.' (And err on the side of caution when someone says: 'Really? We'll see about that')

"There is none so dangerous as the one with nothing to lose"

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## adrianh

I think that the problem lies in this statement "I thought it was a warranty repair". Lets say you took the car in and simply said "please fix it" and they did fix it as you requested then it is your own fault for assuming that it is a warranty repair and that they are obliged to quote you first. They did as you asked!

As the saying goes "assumption is the mother of all f*ckups"

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## flaker

Did u pay when u fetched your vehicle?

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## sterne.law@gmail.com

They were still required to give a quote before doing any work.
Once you took the car, they lost their lien over it.

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Darkangelyaya (08-Nov-12), Dave A (08-Nov-12)

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## adrianh

Why were they required to give a quote if the lady didn't ask for a quote?

I ask this because when I take my car in for a service and don't ask for a quote then they simply go ahead and do whats needed.

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## Justloadit

If I am not mistaken, it is now part of the CPA law. 
If you give no quote and do the job, and the client does not pay, then you have no right to demand payment, as you were not authorised to do the job.

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Darkangelyaya (08-Nov-12)

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## Dave A

> Why were they required to give a quote if the lady didn't ask for a quote?


Read S15 of the Consumer Protection Act.

Having just had a JSE listed company try to prematurely wriggle out of a contract today by trying to invoke a clause in the CPA, I had better mention that the CPA *does not apply at all* where the consumer is a juristic person with assets or annual turnover exceeding (currently) R2 million in terms of S5 2) b), and many of the other sections start with a clause that can further limit applicability too.

I'll say this too, CPA or not, nowadays I wouldn't do *any* work for *anybody* without first giving an estimate *and* receiving written authorisation to proceed. It's just good practice that stops all kinds of needless nonsense.

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Darkangelyaya (08-Nov-12)

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## Darkangelyaya

The vehicle was taken to the specific workshop in order to determine whether it was a warranty claim or not. This was my instruction.
If it was a valid claim, then obviously I would've had to be informed, and they would've had to repair it under warranty.
If it wasn't, then they had to inform me of such, and given me the opportunity to decided whether I want them to QUOTE on repair, or whether I want to have it repaired somehere else.

@adrianh: Nope, I definitely did not ask them to fix it.

@flaker: No, I didn't. And I am not going to, ever. Watch them try and get this to court.

@Justloadit: Indeed. Truth.

Of course they also tried to sabotage the vehicle by doing itty-bitty things such as removing the inner housing of the radiator cap, so it would overheat after a while. But I expected something like this, and was one step ahead. (Oh, make that two, since I have my vehicle back, and they have no right to claim any payment from me).

@adrianh: A service is something completely different from determining the validity of a warranty repair. For starters, you requested the service. I did not request a repair. And even under a service, they are required to list and quote on everything, and get additional permission from the client to fit anything unusual.

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## Darkangelyaya

> Read S15 of the Consumer Protection Act.
> 
> Having just had a JSE listed company try to prematurely wriggle out of a contract today by trying to invoke a clause in the CPA, I had better mention that the CPA *does not apply at all* where the consumer is a juristic person with assets or annual turnover exceeding (currently) R2 million in terms of S5 2) b), and many of the other sections start with a clause that can further limit applicability too.
> 
> I'll say this too, CPA or not, nowadays I wouldn't do *any* work for *anybody* without first giving an estimate *and* receiving written authorisation to proceed. It's just good practice that stops all kinds of needless nonsense.


And we all learn that lesson the hard way, it seems.

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## Rafael

Has she not come back to you, since you took your car back.

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## Darkangelyaya

> Has she not come back to you, since you took your car back.


Nope, not a word.
See, her Head Office has it on record that she admitted to not following protocol.
They have no case.

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## Citizen X

> I need some information please: 
> My vehicle broke down and was towed in to the company who replaced most of the engine in June, at a cost of R28 000.00. I saw it as a warranty repair, and the vehicle was towed in to the said workshop, two weeks ago. 
> 
> At NO stage was I ever informed that this was NOT going to be repaired under a warranty claim. I called the Owner of the workshop daily for updates. At NO stage whatsoever was I ever informed that the vehicle is being repaired AT MY OWN COST. At NO stage did I receive any quotation, estimate, or information that an estimate will be done once the engine has been opened. I NEVER signed any CPA forms, or gave any written consent at all; I never even telephonically or verbally consented to repairs being done. (I record important phone conversations). 
> 
> On Monday, I was informed that they are putting oil in the vehicle and will test it on that day, and that I can then come and fetch it as soon as I have paid the bill. I was blown away, and enquired as to when I actually gave permission for repairs not under warranty, and in fact... where was the quote?!!! I then received the quote, with Monday's date on it - for R 12 000.00.
> 
> I have lodged a formal complaint with their Head Office, who referred me to the MIO for arbitration, as the franchise is independantly owned.
> 
> ...


Good morning Carin,
I would firstly like to impress upon you that the very first thing that I have done is to put myself in your position and ask: How would I react and respond? *I would feel robbed, deceived, and very angry*!
1. In my opinion you have several valid grounds for a complaint to the Consumer Commissioner. In my opinion there was intentional misrepresentation. 
2. Your immediate problem is that you really need and want your car now! The workshop/panel-beater is refusing to hand over the car unless they get payment;
3. *The police are likely to tell you that this is a civil matter and that they don’t get involved in a civil matter;*
4. Might I suggest that, apart from other dispute resolution mechanisms you’ve already initiated, name and shame this company/business right here! Then, inform them of this and state that you want them to provide right of reply;
5. Any member that then wants to put questions to this business may do so, other affected clients may also happen upon this thread and have similar complaints!
6. *The only practical way, in my opinion, that you can really get your car back in the shortest period of time is by a court order.
(As Flaker has correctly pointed out, you've already taken delivery of your vehicle, so what I've shared with you is not really applicable here!(Sorry!)*

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Darkangelyaya (10-Nov-12)

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## flaker

"The only practical way, in my opinion, that you can really get your car back in the shortest period of time is by a court order."

Which horse you're riding, Vanash? :Embarrassment:  The lady  is "riding" her car right now,having taking delivery without any sort of payment

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Citizen X (10-Nov-12)

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## Citizen X

> "The only practical way, in my opinion, that you can really get your car back in the shortest period of time is by a court order."
> 
> Which horse you're riding, Vanash? The lady is "riding" her car right now,having taking delivery without any sort of payment


Clearly the wrong horse!!! :Embarrassment:  I was actually responding directly to the very first post of Carin! :Oops:

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Darkangelyaya (10-Nov-12)

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## SilverNodashi

> "The only practical way, in my opinion, that you can really get your car back in the shortest period of time is by a court order."
> 
> Which horse you're riding, Vanash? The lady  is "riding" her car right now,having taking delivery without any sort of payment


It would be interesting to know how show got her car back. Most places will keep the keys locked away, and the car securely stored until the invoice has been paid. Bypassing their security, and or procedures to get the cars could result in a case of trespassing - but we don't actually know how she got her car back. 

I'm not saying what the garage did was right, but should one resort to breaking the law to re-claim your own car?

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## Darkangelyaya

> It would be interesting to know how show got her car back. Most places will keep the keys locked away, and the car securely stored until the invoice has been paid. Bypassing their security, and or procedures to get the cars could result in a case of trespassing - but we don't actually know how she got her car back. 
> 
> I'm not saying what the garage did was right, but should one resort to breaking the law to re-claim your own car?


I went and asked to test-drive my vehicle, together with the mechanic who worked on it. They voluntarily handed me the keys to my vehicle which was standing outside in the parking lot.
After the testdrive I came back to the workshop, locked my vehicle, walked into the owner's office, and told her that I am taking my vehicle (outside in the public parking lot).
She asked what about the payment, I told her that I never authorized any work, and do not intend to pay for anything.
I walked out.
Breaking the law?! Funny.

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Citizen X (11-Nov-12), Dave A (12-Nov-12), Mike C (12-Nov-12)

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## Darkangelyaya

And I would do it again, in a heartbeat.

As a nation, we are too timid in standing up for ourselves. We complain about poor service etc. on online forums, instead of taking actions that have positive effects on service levels. I have been guilty of this too - like eating a disappointing meal in a restaurant - but instead of demanding good food for hard-earned cash, I just never go there again.

And yet, when I provide a service to a client, I go out of my way to make sure they are happy, to the point of doing additonal work that negatively affect my profit margin.

It's time we all get some backbone, and stand up for our rights. Life is not a dress-rehearsal. This is it.

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Citizen X (11-Nov-12)

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## adrianh

You rock...you have bigger balls...sorry 'guts' than 99% of the men out there... :Devil2:

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Darkangelyaya (11-Nov-12)

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## flaker

> You rock...you have bigger balls...sorry 'guts' than 99% of the men out there...


Agree. make that now 99.1%.

You're a star,Darkangelyaya..

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Darkangelyaya (11-Nov-12)

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## Citizen X

> I went and asked to test-drive my vehicle, together with the mechanic who worked on it. They voluntarily handed me the keys to my vehicle which was standing outside in the parking lot.
> After the testdrive I came back to the workshop, locked my vehicle, walked into the owner's office, and told her that I am taking my vehicle (outside in the public parking lot).
> She asked what about the payment, I told her that I never authorized any work, and do not intend to pay for anything.
> I walked out.
> Breaking the law?! Funny.


Carin, you my latest inspiration! :Embarrassment:

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Darkangelyaya (11-Nov-12)

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## SilverNodashi

> I went and asked to test-drive my vehicle, together with the mechanic who worked on it. They voluntarily handed me the keys to my vehicle which was standing outside in the parking lot.
> After the testdrive I came back to the workshop, locked my vehicle, walked into the owner's office, and told her that I am taking my vehicle (outside in the public parking lot).
> She asked what about the payment, I told her that I never authorized any work, and do not intend to pay for anything.
> I walked out.
> Breaking the law?! Funny.


Sorry. I realize my previous statement could have come across incorrect. I never meant to insult you at all, but merely wanted to know what their security procedures were?

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## Darkangelyaya

> Sorry. I realize my previous statement could have come across incorrect. I never meant to insult you at all, but merely wanted to know what their security procedures were?


No problem.
Thanks Guys!

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## Mike C

Well done Darkangel!  That was brilliant - and inspirational.

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Darkangelyaya (12-Nov-12)

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## Darkangelyaya

Update:
I wave at them every time I drive by there...
They NEVER wave back!

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## adrianh

Good one.

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