# Social Category > South African Politics Forum > [Question] How to make South Africa prosperous?

## Heating

My fellow South Africans, what do you think is the first challenge we need to overcome to make our country a prosperous nation?

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## New Perspective studio

Well  nobody will touch this it seems, there a ton that needs to be done.

 I believe we can try rid ourselves of corruption, crime, economic problems, poverty ect ect but all of these problems have one thing that shelters them from the scrutiny they deserve. 

That my friend is hiding behind and pushing the race agenda. Once somebody starts that fire all reason goes out the window, never mind our president and the Anc or other parties in robbing us blind. "Look at what the pink people are doing to the yellow ones, we cant stand for that". Cue government "We wont stand for this, now is the time for us to unite ( for the millionth time )". The uneducated masses fall in line expecting free handouts nce justice is served, not knowing that should it come to that they are going to get as much as the guys from Zim got. 

Its a education problem, its also a generational problem the decline of of youth morals, I have seen it in my own people im sure it takes place all over.


Maybe education would be up there too on the top of that list. You cant however teach those who dot want to learn, and I am referring to all races.

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## GCE

In my opinion 

*Zero tolerance to petty crime* 
similar to - if you look after the Cents the Rand's will take care of themselves.
Many moons ago, a mate from the wrong side of the line in Glasgow said that the problem in the country is we used to have an argument and throw a punch , now the knives are coming out , if you don't put a stop to it the guns will come out - We all know how that has gone.
In the same conversation he said there is no policing/consequence for going through an orange robot , it will not be long when red will be ignored.We all know how that has gone.

*Radical improvement of the education system starting at Grade R and concentrating on mathematics and not the wishy washy maths literacy.*
If we have a nation that is strong in Maths they will automatically have strong logical thought process to solving the problems we face.
I have found that employing people with a strong maths mark have the ability to see a problem , break it down into manageable steps and solve each piece of the puzzle.The weaker or non existent maths mind becomes overwhelmed with the problem in front of them and does not seem to be able to get the problem solved without roping in an excessive amount of people and time.
When I talk problem , I do not mean mathematical problem, but any problem.
They do also not buckle under pressure , because there is no pressure as everything is solvable 

*If we strengthen those 2 weaknesses and throw them at any problem we have discussed or read about in the past week - Will there still be a problem ?*

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arabianmaiden (16-Apr-19), Blurock (07-Oct-18)

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## Heating

Thank you guys for feedback. I would agree that the main challenge is education. GCE, your opinion is on target and its a pity that the people who should be reading these kind of posts are too busy being illiterate.

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## Dave A

The first step would be to get this question elevated to the top of our politicians' agenda.
It's all about priorities, and let's face it - working towards prosperity *for all* is certainly not the top priority of our political elite.

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## New Perspective studio

> In my opinion 
> 
> *Zero tolerance to petty crime* 
> similar to - if you look after the Cents the Rand's will take care of themselves.
> Many moons ago, a mate from the wrong side of the line in Glasgow said that the problem in the country is we used to have an argument and throw a punch , now the knives are coming out , if you don't put a stop to it the guns will come out - We all know how that has gone.
> In the same conversation he said there is no policing/consequence for going through an orange robot , it will not be long when red will be ignored.We all know how that has gone.
> 
> *Radical improvement of the education system starting at Grade R and concentrating on mathematics and not the wishy washy maths literacy.*
> If we have a nation that is strong in Maths they will automatically have strong logical thought process to solving the problems we face.
> ...


I cannot argue with this its on point. 

I would like to add however as my wife is a teacher, their hands are tied they are unable to teach even those few that are privileged enough to receive a education because they have absolutely no respect for anybody. This problem comes from home. You cannot teach those who do not want to learn, and then the even fewer that do want to learn cannot as everything is disrupted... So maybe, our problems start at home, with the integrity and respect and values we teach our children...
Its hard however to teach those values when you are growing, raising your child in a environment surrounded by crime, poverty and constant struggles, its a vicious circle. 

You say "Zero tolerance to petty crime" agreed...I say "Zero tolerance to disrespecting elders", Im saying bring back corporal punishment, teach them while they are young. 

I was in school when the sylabis allowed for maths literacy, I was there when a pass mark went from 50% to 35%, I was there when they dissolved corporal punishment, and with each of these changes the youth, the kids coming in below me would shock me more and more with the crazy things that happened at school. First it was disrespecting teachers, then sex at schools, then stabbings, then hitting teachers... became more and more degenerate. 

Parents have become so liberal, its a joke where when teachers do the little they can and call in parents to discuss a childs problematic behaviour, most of them will side with their child despite them being grossly wrong. 

I understand its a parents nature to defend his/ her children, but at some point we have got to stop being so soft and say listen kid you messed up...You need to learn a lesson out of this.

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## New Perspective studio

> The first step would be to get this question elevated to the top of our politicians' agenda.
> It's all about priorities, and let's face it - working towards prosperity *for all* is certainly not the top priority of our political elite.


Indeed, my view of that is maybe a little skewed, I believe most if not all countries have their fair share of corrupt, self serving politicians, however they are somewhat regulated , by a "more intelligent" following, whistle blowers, dare I say good politicians and most importantly no monopoly on votes. 

When a countries people are unhappy with their government, they dont take excuses for poor performance or corruption, they go to another party and this keeps the party somewhat honest ( if you dont perform you wont be here for the next term ).

In South Africa, our people dont see the corruption, turn a blind eye because they are hoping to get in on the gravy train, or simply see no other voting alternative due to our countries history, some even hope the Anc will change. I think to many, it has been painted as, a non ANC South Africa will become an "apartheid regime" again. 

The Anc sees it has monopoly so why should it really deliver, it will be here again next term... A healthy democracy needs at least two closely competing parties ideally three I was told.

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Amahle Dladsa (23-Feb-21), Blurock (07-Oct-18)

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## Dr Thomas

The first step would be to vote the ANC out in 2019.  Don't believe your vote doesn't count.

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## New Perspective studio

> The first step would be to vote the ANC out in 2019.  Don't believe your vote doesn't count.


And here i am dancing around my words hoping not to offend anybody. Lol. The voters who would leave the ANC would go to the EFF most likely, never the DA ( let me stop dancing, they are probably the most realistic shot we have at some sort of order ). Im not sure if we would be better off or worse off with the EFF although im leaning towards the latter.

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## Blurock

People who vote for the ANC is almost like a woman suffering from battered wife syndrome. They know that it hurts, they know that it will hurt again, they know that it is evil, but they are too blind to see an alternative. Democracy gives you the power to VOTE. 

Vote for your own councillor who can represent you in local government. Vote for your representative in parliament. If they SERVE you well, vote for them again. If they don't, vote them OUT OF POWER. Vote for an alternative. DO NOT burn down your child's school, the library and public buildings. The money used to rebuild it could have build more houses and infrastructure and created jobs. DO NOT stone passing cars, as those could be the people who could have assisted you to turn things around. By stoning their cars and torching their trucks and businesses, you are just turning them against you as well.

DO NOT follow a party blindly. Look at their record and use your brain to choose wisely. The future of your children are at stake. If we do not start doing the right things now, it may be too late and we may just become another Zimbabwe. S.O.S.

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## ians

STOP BUILDING MASSIVE WAREHOUSES TO DISTRIBUTE RUBBISH FROM CHINA. 

Start building more factories and homes for the people of this country.

Execute all corrupt "public servants" who steal earnings from the hard working public.

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## ians

> And here i am dancing around my words hoping not to offend anybody. Lol. The voters who would leave the ANC would go to the EFF most likely, never the DA ( let me stop dancing, they are probably the most realistic shot we have at some sort of order ). Im not sure if we would be better off or worse off with the EFF although im leaning towards the latter.


The EFF will take over this country. The question is are you ready for that kind of radical change.

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## Heating

I think with the EFF, things will be worse. Don't forget they went to look for advice from Chavez, and look at Venezuela today. I think the only thing that was achieved from all those meetings, are red berets!! Lol.

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## Heating

"Do not follow a party blindly", how do you get that message to the masses? Here in South Africa, the masses do not read not listen to the news. It is so easy to manipulate them into believing the injustices veiled as truth.

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## Heating

Can someone ever be ready to be taken over by a government like the EFF? I don't even think that the people who can vote them in are aware of the Hell South Africa could become.

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## BusFact

My 2c: As soon as someone becomes economically empowered:

 - The incentive to commit crime reduces.
 - They are able to educate their children (and possibly themselves) which in turn leads to better political decision making and allows an economy to grow.

By economically empowered I don't necessarily mean be given a job. Although thats nice, I don't think its possible on the scale we require. Instead everyone should be starting and running their own business. I'm not naive, I know that this has huge hurdles, such as finding markets to supply your services or products and coming up with ideas for products and services. However if we could make it happen, it would be a huge boost.

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## BusFact

> STOP BUILDING MASSIVE WAREHOUSES TO DISTRIBUTE RUBBISH FROM CHINA. 
> 
> Start building more factories and homes for the people of this country.


This I think is crucial. I have some serious doubts about a blanket open world market. We cannot compete against China when we have different rules on labour. And no I don't advocate reducing the standards for SA labour, I just don't think cheap Chinese goods should be brought into our country at the expense of competitive local suppliers. Export / Import markets should be for goods that cannot be obtained locally or where there is an uncompetitive local market sector.

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## Heating

The picture that you paint here would be ideal. However, don't forget that we are in a vicious circle where the people vote the corrupt in and the corrupt takes the people's money AND yet, next elections they will continue to vote the corrupt back into power!! How do we break this circle?

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## ians

I am told...80 % of Africa is already owned by China....i wonder when they plan to come in and clean up. 

The bottom line is money talks and shyte walks...as silly as this statement sounds...the reality is everyone can be bought ...at a price...and boy are the greedy taking advantage.

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## Smiley

All the ideas shared are spot on on what can be done to improve it all, I agree.

However ... I am a wee bit pessimistic.

How to implement all these good ideas, how to get them working consistently, as education is wot, a 20(?), year plan. So multiple presidencies, no?
Job creation, infrastructure upgrades ... decades.

As good as the success stories are out there, and there are, a lot, we, the majority, have become irrelevant. 

Let me explain, illustrate, non factual, authors freedom: How many people actually vote in SA?
Wikipedia says in 2014 there where 18,5mil valid votes and 252 000 spoilt votes.
Total votes cast was 18,75 mil votes
Registered Voters: 25,4 mil
Total population: +-54-56 mil people.

So less than half of SA votes. (Are u/18 the 50%, illegal immigrants?)
And of that half a few mil more than actually half voted.
With more and more non-deliverance from political parties, those voters may become even less.

To fix the problem we need a leader/s that can pull this nation together, the majority votes, under one flag, as one nation ... s[he] will have to be a "super hero", for divisive (as a nation) we stand.

So get a leader, the rest will follow, and together we WILL sort it all out.

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## HealthyDozen

Mr Ramaphosa, I challenge you to do the things that make you remembered as the next Nelson Mandela - or greater.
Build a nation educated on a par with the world's highest standards of education, not our diluted sub-standard grading to appease the masses.
The jobs will come, the tolerance for crime and corruption will go. The confidence in South Africa will grow.

Jacob Zuma had that opportunity and blew it. He will forever be remembered as a scoundrel, a crook, a thief, a liar, a looter and the man who almost destroyed a nation.
Nothing he can ever do will change this. His legacy is set.

Ask yourself: "How do I want to be recorded in history?" As a Zuma, a Mussolini, a Mugabe, a Stalin, a Chavez, an Amin?

You have limited time to make a positive memorable impact. And the clock is ticking....

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## magiclifestyle

A Positive Revolution based on a few key principles that inspire a large enough cross-section of the population to make a significant difference. 
_Few enough to be counted on the fingers of one hand and simple enough for the youngest child to be inspired to dream great things._

In 2008 I wrote a manifesto called *Coalition of Hope* based on Eduard de Bono's book Positive Revolution and presented my thoughts on five key principles as a starting point for dialogue; every individual can choose their own five principles, then collaborate with others who share similar principles and eventually a national set of principles will emerge. 



What are your five key principles? 

You can find the PDF here https://shaunlindbergh.files.wordpre...pe-oct2008.pdf 

If you live in Gauteng check out Mobilise Gauteng (http://mobilisegauteng.co.za/), a community network for people who want to make a positive difference. (Cape Town relaunching in 2019)

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## nsawdon

Is it not time to put a plan in place to get out of this mess.

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## Heating

Education, education, education...The education starts at home. Yes, I totally agree with your views.

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Blurock (29-Oct-18)

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## Blurock

> Education, education, education...The education starts at home. Yes, I totally agree with your views.


I totally agree, but at home the parents are not interested. I do not want to sound pessimistic, but we have to look at reality. 
Children are brought up in violent environments where there is alcohol and drug abuse at home. Women get assaulted and children accept it as the norm. Gangsterism and total disrespect of self and society. That attitude is carried into our schools and our communities which are getting more and more violent. 
Maybe we should get more involved and start talking to each other instead of just pointing fingers and accepting the (worsening) status quo.
When last did you speak to your employees about their situation? Are you helping with domestic violence or the child's drug addiction? 
The lesson of the starfish comes to mind here.

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New Perspective studio (06-Nov-18)

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## Heating

You are 100% percent correct. You have eloquently painted the reality of our situation. Maybe our hope lays in the few people who still has compassion for others.  Ps. I do talk to my employees about their alcohol consumption, for the past 20 years!!!

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## ians

> Ps. I do talk to my employees about their alcohol consumption, for the past 20 years!!!


You cannot help people who cannot help themselves...by this i mean...you can jump up an down...scream ...threaten...nag and do whatever you think will change a person...the only time the change takes place is when that person is ready for the change...generally it takes a bad incident to motivate change.

an example...generally speaking...a fat person would need to have a heart attack or find out they have cancer or some other serious medical condition to make them change their bad eating habits...the problem with alcohol...people turn to alcohol when the going gets tough...alcohol is seen as a way to be happy...socialise and enjoy life.

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## Heating

In my opinion, I think we should have hope and be positive. There is just too much negativity and grimness around us. Maybe tomorrow when we wake up, we should try waking up with a smile and positive attitude. Surely that would have ripple effect.

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Blurock (15-Nov-18)

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## New Perspective studio

I think that a good idea, IF hope and positivity inspires action to change... In most cases I think however people dont go past that, they stay on that it limits them and things never change. 
Major social and political shifts from the people throughout history have always come from discontent, anger. When people are tired of hoping and know action is needed...when the pain of staying the same becomes greater than the pain of change, hope is what allows them to continue with their actions when it seems they are failing to persevere against impossible odds. 
SO we have anger and discontent I know...
Burning down things and blaming the other race for problems, extended court arguments and investigations which in years dont amount to anything... Those are our current actions.
In the many years this has been happening what has really changed for the better? Nothing yet its the continued tactic. 
They say the definition of stupidity is doing the same thing and expecting a different result...

We need education.

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## Smiley

> We need education.


*Two thoughts:*
I took 20+ years to break the SA education system, dumb it down, on purpose, as per the Russian manual on how to keep control of the population.

To fix it will take another generation and each year it is delayed, is another year added to the 20. 


*Current Situation:*
We don't have the money nor the political willpower to fix it as those in charge have larger problems to focus on like the continuing fallout of State Capture, ANC factions etc.

We need leaders that can fiercely go where no-one has gone before. 

Maybe Cyril pulls through, still too early ito the factions. SA will hop along till Cyril gets the rot cut out, sorted for the next SA president of sterling character.

.... or something is going to snap somewhere.


*What irks the hell out of me.*
Not for one moment do I believe the likes of Cyril and every other person of "power" in Government, the banks, the Reserve Bank, large media outlets, did not know of the rot. 

KPMG knew. Monjane knew. Zuma knew. Mbeki knew ... list goes on and on.

"They" knew.

Today everyone is shocked when the likes of the Daily Maverick gets "new" evidence and publishes it.

Some news outlets published blatantly false information, having had to give back awards and having to retract the reports, not properly investigated ... ja right.

"They" all know in which cupboards the skeletons are kept. 
Problem is, to open all the doors will result in thousands and thousands of criminal prosecutions, if taken from the top to the bottom.


And it is not only SA, it is an international problem.

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## Heating

Yes, you right. It is most definitely an international problem.

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## Blurock

Staying positive is not easy, but treating everyone that comes across your path with respect, is very easy.
One thing that I have learnt is that attitude affects outcomes. It is not what you say to people, but how you say it.
People will forget what you have said, but they will always remember the way you made them feel.

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Dave A (15-Nov-18)

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## Heating

> Staying positive is not easy, but treating everyone that comes across your path with respect, is very easy.
> One thing that I have learnt is that attitude affects outcomes. It is not what you say to people, but how you say it.
> People will forget what you have said, but they will always remember the way you made them feel.


Very well said. And this is how positivity is spread!! Thank you Blurock.

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## Heating

We running out of choices and it would seem Ramaphosa is the only one who can control the masses.

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## Blurock

> We running out of choices and it would seem Ramaphosa is the only one who can control the masses.


Why vote for the same rot to continue? It is every citizen's moral duty to always vote politicians OUT of power, not IN to power.
A political party is not a club that you belong to for life. "I vote XYZ because my father voted XYZ". What idiotic argument!
Most South Africans are not able to debate around politics and do not have a clue about democracy, but then again, democracy is maybe not the right political system for our country?

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## Blurock

The forrest was declining and getting smaller. However, the trees still voted for the axe. 
Because its handle was made of wood, they regarded it as one of them. :Surrender:

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## Derlyn

Tired of politicians ?   Don't vote for them ...   simple.

Purple cow. Google. Enough said.

Derek

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Blurock (19-Apr-20)

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## Lycorahavyn

> We running out of choices and it would seem Ramaphosa is the only one who can control the masses.


it just seems to you that every new person who comes will bring new problems

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## adrianh

> it just seems to you that every new person who comes will bring new problems


The issue is that it is always the same old stupid people and the same old stupid problems...

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## Blurock

To make South Africa great again, we will require a new government with a new mindset and a major change in our labour laws.
Where do jobs come from? From employers of course.
So how do we entice investors and entrepreneurs to start new ventures? Not by demonizing a sector of society that provides all-important jobs. The time has come to revisit our labour laws so that we can collectively create h for all. https://www.biznews.com/thought-lead...hina-economics 

This is a must-read article by Anthony Levine on the Gods of Economics

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## adrianh

"Again" ??? It was never "Great" for all races.

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## Blurock

> "Again" ??? It was never "Great" for all races.


Agreed, there has always been exploitation or oppression of some groups in South Africa. Many wars have been fought ever since its history had been recorded.
However, there was a time when the country prospered, everyone had a job, the country had a high growth rate and a strong currency.
There was relative peace. Politically it was still a shambles, but economically there was hardly a better place to be.
What is the use of Uhuru if your children goes to bed on an empty stomach?

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## adrianh

> Agreed, there has always been exploitation or oppression of some groups in South Africa. Many wars have been fought ever since its history had been recorded.
> However, there was a time when the country prospered, everyone had a job, the country had a high growth rate and a strong currency.
> There was relative peace. Politically it was still a shambles, but economically there was hardly a better place to be.
> What is the use of Uhuru if your children goes to bed on an empty stomach?


Oh nonsense. There was never a time when everybody prospered. "Relative peace" was at the hand of police and brutal pass laws. Yes of course a small part of the population prospered but it all came to an end when the world decided that SA could not continue along the same path as Israel. Come on, we can't rewrite history - the one group makes out as if it was wonderful and the other group makes out as if it was absolutely terrible. To sort of quote the orange idiot "There were good and bad people on both sides" I understand what the NP was trying to do at the time and I understand why it failed. 

The only given in this country is that it will return to its roots...we can either figure ways to prosper whilst riding that taxi, bitch n moan about it or hit the road. The problem today is that the entire world is in the same boat - there is no green grass elsewhere - all the grass is covered in dead bodies, unemployment and face masks...

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## Blurock

There is a difference between political freedom and financial prosperity. In both cases there is exploitation of minorities either for political power or financial gain. That is happening all over the world to a greater or lesser extent.  Prosperity is when a country has a strong balance of payment, strong growth and its citizens are relatively happy. One can still be prosperous and flourish without agreeing with or being happy with the rulers of your country. In our case both our financial and political prosperity have been curbed.

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## Xineadola

as in any country, everything depends on these politicians, and in general on people, such and the result will be

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## Blurock

> as in any country, everything depends on these politicians, and in general on people, such and the result will be


So why do you not vote them out of power? Why do you allow politicians to lie and corrupt and just accept it?
People tend to "not want to get involved" because it is not the politically correct thing to do or because it may harm their self-interest.
Or are they just too lazy to act and too stupid to realize the consequences of a corrupt government?

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## adrianh

> So why do you not vote them out of power? Why do you allow politicians to lie and corrupt and just accept it?
> People tend to "not want to get involved" because it is not the politically correct thing to do or because it may harm their self-interest.
> Or are they just too lazy to act and too stupid to realize the consequences of a corrupt government?


Real power lies in the money backing governments (governments are merely pawns) You can vote all you like, big money controls governments no matter which political party happens to be the face at the time...

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## Blurock

> Real power lies in the money backing governments (governments are merely pawns) You can vote all you like, big money controls governments no matter which political party happens to be the face at the time...


Totally agree. I have never believed in the stories about the Illuminati, but a number of facts have surfaced that have forced us to take note. The big conglomerate multinationals have surplus money many times the GDP of most countries. Why should they then not influence what happens in the countries where they operate? What happens behind the scenes at Davos?

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## adrianh

> Totally agree. I have never believed in the stories about the Illuminati, but a number of facts have surfaced that have forced us to take note. The big conglomerate multinationals have surplus money many times the GDP of most countries. Why should they then not influence what happens in the countries where they operate? What happens behind the scenes at Davos?


It is not the Illuminati and all that kinda nonsense, it is big business like the military manufacturing industry in the US, big pharma, the oil industry etc...

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## Blurock

> It is not the Illuminati and all that kinda nonsense, it is big business like the military manufacturing industry in the US, big pharma, the oil industry etc...


...serving the political and financial interests of big money.

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## ians

Been watching the "blacklist" on netflix... just a movie but it makes you think.

watching the way the media make the riots in the USA look like covid 19 around the world ... the USA are scratching in everyones elses salads and cant even protect the people in thier own country ... people shyting on trumps lawn ... he even had to go spend a night in a bunker while the skateboarding community graffiti everything... what a joke... just imagine if China decided to have a go at them... where will he hide?

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