# Interest group forums > Energy and Resource Conservation Forum >  Understanding a Sunsynk inverter

## Isetech

Note! I am no expert in this field, what's called winging it, feel free to steer me in the right direction or correct any incorrect information. 

I am busy preparing to setup and 5 kva Sunsynk inverter, which will be linked to a 5 kwh battery and a couple of panels.
*
Lets start with the panels selection.*

Now that I know what inverter I will be using, I can choose the panels.

The Sunsynk has 2 MMPT inputs, which means I can connect 2 strings.

For now I will be only using 1 of the 2 mppt's.

How many panels can I install, I would need to look at the inverter specs

PV String Input Data

Max. DC Input Power 6500W
PV Input Voltage 370V (100V~500V)
MPPT Range 125~425V
Full Load DC Voltage Range 240~425V
Start-up Voltage 150V
PV Input Current 11A+11A
No. of MPPT Trackers 2
No. of Strings Per MPPT Tracker 1+1

What would I look at first, the current rating of the panel, if the current rating of the panel is 550 watt, 13 amps and the VOC is 40 volts. Can I use this panel for this inverter? no. Why because the current is too high for the inverter (11A).

I would have to look at a smaller panel, lets say 380 watt, 10 amps and 40 VOC. Can I use this panel? Yes, because the current is within the inverter current range.

How many panels can I link in series to create a string? The max V for the inverter is 500V, but you dont wan to go to the max so working within the MPPT range would be as better option. 425/40=10.6. It would be advisable to use 10 panels.

The max DC input is 6500 watt, 10 panels at 380 watt = 3800 watt. 

IF you plan to use both MPPT's to the max, it would be better to fit 8 panels per string which would give you 3040watt X 2 = 6080 watt.

If you wanted to start out with just a couple panels, what would be the least mount of panels? 125V/40=3.125. It would be advisable to fit at least 3 panels to start with and add as the budget allows.

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Gene (04-Jul-22)

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## Isetech

I am not going to worry too much about technical phrases right now, rather try keep it simple. 

Now that we have selected the panels, its time to select the battery. Something else to consider before we select the battery, the total load.

How many panels would be considered enough for a system, enough to power the essential, non essential and the charge the batteries. 

At a later stage we will look into an actual installation, the correct panels size and quantity required to run a site and then select the inverter and batteries to make it all work.

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## Isetech

Some would say that we should design the system around our power demands, in reality most people cant even afford a full 5 KVA system complete with panels, inverter and battery.

What I have been trying to do, is find a solution which can be installed and then grow, focusing on the power and backup requirements then increasing the components which benefit the customer. For example, if you use more power at night, then a bigger battery bank might be a better option. If you work from home or run a business from home, more panels might be a better option. You also need to understand what it is you are trying to achieve, if you are just looking for a backup system for load shedding, then the design might not be the same as for a person looking for a backup and money saving solution. 

Just remember, no time of use tariff or panels on the roof, your electricity bill will increase, because you need to charge the batteries using the grid power and there are losses.

There is only one consideration which must be taken into account, the budget, if you cant afford a R125 000.00 system, then you need to buy candles and adjust your lifestyle accordingly, maybe get rid of he R25000 cellphone and R1000 a month contract and focus on what is more important in life. IF backup power is not important then, candles and a smart phone it is. 

An 8 kva unit has become the common unit offered to customers, why because it can handle higher loads, as panel size and power increases, so you will have to match the inverter to the panels.

I am focusing on the Sunsynk so all the specs etc will be according to Sunsynk inverters.

As I mentioned earlier, a 550 watt panels with a max current  13 amps cannot be used with a 5kva Sunsynk inverter (11 amp), so you would have to get an 8 kva inverter or get smaller panels.

The VOC (voltage open circuit) is very important and must never be exceeded, but the size of the panel will not determine the VOC, the total VOC is calculated by adding panels in series. The more panels the higher the VOC.

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## Isetech

We move on to selecting batteries for the inverter, there a lot of calculation and explanations on the internet. What I want to focus on is the size of the inverter and the backup.

I have'nt  done any data logging using a lithium battery yet ( my demo will arrive soon), so I will only be able to do true tests once it arrives.

I have done numerous tests using lead acid (gel batteries) which has got me thinking. 

IF you install a 3.6 kva (3600watt) unit with a 24 VDC 100 amp/hr of battery power, you can only backup about 400 watts to last a couple hours, anything over that will drain the batteries so fast that it no longer becomes a viable backup option. 

This got me thinking, why would I install a 5 kva unit with only 1 x 100 amp/hr (5kwh) battery, it just doesnt make sense. Surely it would make more sense to save money and buy a 3.6 kva and get 1 x 100 amp/hr battery. If you can only use 400 watts of the inverter power during load shedding. 

Something to be aware of: Sunsynk has different models for example here are the PV string data. 


3. TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS
 SUNSYNK-3.6K-SG01/03LP1

PV String Input Data
Max. DC Input Power 4680W
PV Input Voltage 370V (100V~500V)
MPPT Range 125~425V
Full Load DC Voltage Range 240~425V
Start-up Voltage 150V
PV Input Current 11A
No. of MPPT Trackers 2
No. of Strings Per MPPT Tracker 1+1


 SUNSYNK-3.6K-SG02LP1

PV String Input Data
Max. DC Input Power (W) 7000W
Voc Max. (V) 500V
MPPT Range (V) 125~425V
Full Load DC Voltage Range (V) 240~425V
Start-up Voltage (V) 150V
PV Input Current (A) 11A+11A
No. of MPPT Trackers 2
No. of Strings Per MPPT Tracker 1+1

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Gene (04-Jul-22)

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## Derlyn

Silly question.
I have 400W panel power (40V 10A)
This is used to charge 2 of 100Ah batteries for the invertor.
The invertor is not connected to mains ie. Only the panels charge the batteries. Output of invertor is connected to db via a changeover switch like a genny installation.

Panels charge batteries via controller.

My silly question is what happens with the panel power when the batteries are fully charged ?

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## GCE

> Silly question.
> I have 400W panel power (40V 10A)
> This is used to charge 2 of 100Ah batteries for the invertor.
> The invertor is not connected to mains ie. Only the panels charge the batteries. Output of invertor is connected to db via a changeover switch like a genny installation.
> 
> Panels charge batteries via controller.
> 
> My silly question is what happens with the panel power when the batteries are fully charged ?


Your MPPT will throttle back to the batteries and possibly switch off if you have no load on the batteries 
It is better to have load and discharge or utilize the solar

When the MPPT throttles the voltage will lift on the panels to the Voc levels which is why it  is important to size equipment to Voc

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## Derlyn

Thank you brother.
Ok, so it's a good thing to keep a bit of a load going. I've got a lot to learn with this solar and inverter scene.

Have a good day

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## Isetech

IF you look around you will see WiFi dongles for around R 2000.

You also see it refered to as  "logger" (apparently the same thing as a WiFi dongle)  for around R900. 

Apparently the WiFI dongle is free with the inverter and the software for the Wifi dongle is free ? 

Can anyone confirm this information? 

If people are charging R2000 for a WiFi Dongle, that means if you dont want a dongle you shouldnt be paying more than R18-20 000.00 for a Sunsynk 5 KVA inverter inc vat ?

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## Justloadit

You require a wifi point which connects to the logger.
The R2000 one is actually the supply of a Pi controller.
What to me that is important with respect to these data loggers, is the following :-

How comprehensive is the available information from my inverter?
How long does the server maintain my information for, hours, days, weeks, months or years?
What does it cost to maintain the connection on the server?
Can I access the data from any web page?

What I am afraid is the the cost only for the hardware and an open access to the web page.
Who maintains the server and pays for the up keep?
It may be financed through the sale of the data loggers, but at some point the sales will drop, and it may be that the maintenance of the server then becomes unsustainable, as has happened before.

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## Isetech

There are a couple of remote viewing options:

We use the Pi3B+ with solar assistant for remote viewing and updating setting on the Axpert type inverter. I have a few of these units on various sites. The challenge is trying to source Pi3B+ units. You can buy the complete Pi unit with the software from Solar assistant already setup or separate.

https://solar-assistant.io/

The WiFi dongle I mentioned in the thread above is specific to Sunsynk, it is supplied "free" or should suppose to be supplied free  with inverter.

The one I have refer to in the previous thread is specific to Sunsynk. It should be included in the sale of the inverter. 

https://arb.co.za/product/sunsynk-wifi-dongle/

You need to make sure that all the components are included in the quote, including the WiFi dongle/logger, software, Firmware updates,  battery comms cable and anything else required to get your new invert operational.

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## Isetech

Boy have we had a few challenges setting up and maintaining these units. If you know of advanced training courses which are Sunsynk specific, please share. 

Most of the challenges have been due to a lack of installer knowledge. There are tons of videos on Sunsynk on WWW to watch if you have a few days spare. 

A few very basic tips which could save you a lot of time on the phone trying to get technical support ( unless you have a direct number) you going to redirected via the UK and to somewhere in the world. Sunsynk support will NOT call you back.

If you email support, make sure you check your spam inbox.

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## Isetech

Tip: 

It is very important to start the battery first, then switch on the inverter. 

Make sure the "on" light in the top left corner of the display indicates ON.

Do not switch on the AC until you have setup the unit and the normal light is on (green).

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## Isetech

Tip:

Battery settings are important, and you need to make sure the battery is communicating. 

A very expensive lesson I learnt, your grid settings are very important. The battery will not charge if the grid settings are not correct. You can change the frequency from 60 to 50 hz (as per SA) but the inverter will not automatically reset the upper and lower limits. You have to manually reset the upper and lower limits. 

Make sure you understand how to initialize the battery, the 5.3 kwh battery for example you must first switch on the rocker switch, then press the button and hold for 3 seconds. The new IP 65 battery 5.1 kwh battery  there is no rocker switch and no delay to switch on.

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## Isetech

Tip 

We had a battery go into shutdown and we couldn't get it to start charging. 

The reason it went into shutdown, when it reaches 80% DOD or 20 % SOC, it doesn't switch off and stop discharging, in fact it drops rather quickly, unless you pull the fuse or switch off the battery, it will just keep dropping. 

Hopefully the battery doesn't drop to zero % DOD. The IP 65 manual indicates that you shouldn't recharge the battery in less than 12 hours, however the technical support will tell you to increase the charge amps. Maybe I need to re check the manual.

You will notice a red fault light, you have to switch off the inverter and battery, try restart the battery and inverter, lower the cutout setting and low battery setting and wait for the inverter to normalize. IF it doesn't normalize and the red fault light keeps switching on, you pretty screwed.

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## Isetech

If there is one thing I have learnt in business, I have said this on numerous occasions. The products you buy and install are only as good as the support from the supplier. 

I have learnt that no matter how many training courses you attend, hours on youtube, watching training videos etc, when you are on site and you get stuck with what might be a really silly issue, the product technical team support will make the difference between you sitting like a knob in front of the customer for hours or a a quick 5 minute solution. 

I deal with many different technical support centres because of the variety of project we get involved in. 

Some technical support centres have specific people who know their stuff and others which you going to waste time waiting for them to find the right page in the manual.

IDS is a good example, I dont waste my time speaking to any of the new support technicians, there is only one person I speak to, she knows her stuff and more important, she is polite and patient with callers. She actually wins the customer support award for 2022. I just hope IDS realize her value and make sure they look after her. They have already lost one of their best counter sales employees and their top technical support person. 

Dealing with Varispeed was another company which use to have good technical support, I recall contacting the owner (Frank)  at 8 pm on a Friday night, while stuck out in the bush in the middle of nowhere, 3 minutes later the plant was ready to run. A simple setting adjustment, that is all it needed. 

Dealing with WEG, setting up VSD's etc, the lads know there stuff and it is such a pleasure to deal with their technical support team.

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## Derlyn

Someone I know had Deye installed but says he is going to change the logger to a Synsynk because the Deye has to be controlled by the installer.

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## Isetech

The Sunsynk installer has full control over the Sunsynk unit. if the customer doesn't pay the bill I can shut the system down. My customers dont have this problem because all their systems are paid up in full. 

The old dongle used Solarman software. 

At one stage you could buy a sunsynk dongle and fit it to a deye unit which is built in the same factory, they look and use the same components, only the software is different (so I am told) and of course the price. 

People got smart and started buying and fitting the Sunsynk dongle to the Deye units for way cheaper than buying a Sunsynk unit with a a free dongle, how true this is I couldnt tell you because I have never done it.

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## Isetech

What is going to be interesting, something I need to check on the other units we have installed. I am going to change the frequency from 50 to 60 and see if the limits reset automatically. 

Another lesson learnt with these Sunsynk units, never assume anything, rather press ok, then go back and check the setting has activated, then run through all the other settings and make sure they have  adjusted accordingly.

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## Isetech

Something else you need to check is the software is the latest version and do a firmware update, if required.

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## Isetech

By the way I am new to Sunsynk products, yes I am going to ask the dumbest of questions and yes 99 % of the issues are going to be installer related, hence the reason I need good technical support, at the press of a button, from people who have experience with these units, who can assist and advise me when I get stuck with silly challenges or installer errors. 

It is a good product and one of the reasons I have chosen to install these units on the majority of my customers sites. The people at Sunsynk are improving the product by the day. We will continue to install products like Victron (the Rolls Royce of inverters), axperts and Luxpower for the customers who dont have the budget for the more expensive units.

Something I have learnt recently, no matter where you buy the unit, the technical support is international (+27 10 100 3589). If you buy the unit from ARB or Voltex the technical support is the same. You call the number, it takes you to a call centre in the UK, you tell them the problem them they will redirect you to someone somewhere in the world, make sure your telephone line has lots of spare minutes.

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## Isetech

Yes anyone can buy a Sunsynk inverter or battery, DIYer, green card holder or registered electrician. We all know that no matter how much everyone is trying to take control of this industry, nothing is going to change for a while yet. 

Because technical support is international, it makes no difference where you buy the unit, price becomes the main factor. 

If you buy the unit from Voltex (bit slow with their response to quote requests) or ARB (fast response and good prices), you will still use the same technical support. Just make sure they have stock before you do the bank transfer, this is a tricky situation. 

It seems the stages of load shedding determine the stock and pricing, some will tell you it is the exchange rate  :Wink:

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