# Social Category > South African Politics Forum >  Death penalty, why not?

## Jacques#1

This morning driving to my first client I heard on the radio about another baby raped.  6 Weeks old!!! :Mad:   WTF?  Why cant we have the death penalty back?  Yes, I hear you, person shouting in the background, stating that we humans cannot decide on the life of another human.  But isnt that exactly what these pigs, animals, worthless excuses for life are doing?  So surely we can judge the judge?

I feel they should bring back the death penalty, include rape, molestation and murder. Done.  You'll see the stats drop like flies.

If youre the type of person that need to justify things to yourself before accepting it, heres one....If you can rape a child, surely you are not made up of the things a normal human being is made up of, in a civilised society?  So technically youre an animal, and we slaughter animals by the thousands daily, so shoving a rapist into a guilotine is nothing more than slaughtering a cow.....makes sense to me?

Why cant we have a special set of votes per year?  We leave everything to government, and they decide how things must be run, even though everyone feels strongly against or for a specific point.  Why not ask the country, do you want the death penalty back?  Vote next month on a secret ballot, we'll count it, and then rule in favour?  Wouldnt this be the perfect democracy... :Confused:

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## tec0

I share your anger but fear that our justice system may not be up to the task. Considering all the corruption cases within the justice system there is a very real chance for abuse. Sentencing an innocent person to death is just as bad. 

If our system was more trustworthy if we had better training and technology like the first world countries have then I would agree that offenders like these be put to death. Harming a child like that is in my opinion the worst possible crime that exists today. The fact that it exist at all is beyond my comprehension.

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## Jacques#1

> I share your anger but fear that our justice system may not be up to the task. Considering all the corruption cases within the justice system there is a very real chance for abuse. Sentencing an innocent person to death is just as bad. 
> 
> If our system was more trustworthy if we had better training and technology like the first world countries have then I would agree that offenders like these be put to death. Harming a child like that is in my opinion the worst possible crime that exists today. The fact that it exist at all is beyond my comprehension.


I completely agree with you, especially convicting an innocent man, but death row does not happen overnight.  These court cases usually drag on for a couple of years, enough time to convict the right person.  I believe that just the mere fact that the death penalty is back, will instill some fear in these animals.  They know that doing this will not result in a 10 year vacation in a jail cell, with food, water, central heating and a soft bed to sleep on, with us idiots paying for all of it, rather the end of what he knows as life itself.

I have two small babies, if this would happen to me, i honestly do not know what i will do, dont want to think about it.  I do however know that I will be judge, jury and executioner if it had to happen to my children, wouldnt care about anything else at that point i guess?

People often judge too quickly from my experience.  You've got the one crowd that says no to the death penalty, you've got another crowd that says no to guns....If they are left in the victims shoes, staring down a knife with a criminal on top of them, i bet they wish they had a gun in their hands at that point, and once youve been the victim of serious crimes, like I have, you shout for the death penalty.

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## tec0

> I completely agree with you, especially convicting an innocent man, but death row does not happen overnight.  These court cases usually drag on for a couple of years, enough time to convict the right person.  I believe that just the mere fact that the death penalty is back, will instill some fear in these animals.  They know that doing this will not result in a 10 year vacation in a jail cell, with food, water, central heating and a soft bed to sleep on, with us idiots paying for all of it, rather the end of what he knows as life itself.
> 
> I have two small babies, if this would happen to me, i honestly do not know what i will do, dont want to think about it.  I do however know that I will be judge, jury and executioner if it had to happen to my children, wouldnt care about anything else at that point i guess?
> 
> People often judge too quickly from my experience.  You've got the one crowd that says no to the death penalty, you've got another crowd that says no to guns....If they are left in the victims shoes, staring down a knife with a criminal on top of them, i bet they wish they had a gun in their hands at that point, and once youve been the victim of serious crimes, like I have, you shout for the death penalty.


Evil has many faces make no mistake. Like you said people always say things like if it was me I would have done this or that Well like you said they havent experience powerlessness yet. They dont know the heaviness, the brutality not to mention that it turns your body into a prison your mind the only prisoner. 

They have no idea of the anger that eats you up and the horror of reliving each moment over and over again for the rest of your life. Time is no factor because it doesnt matter if you grow up it doesnt matter if you grow old. The torment is inside of you. Then the voices come and they make sure you will never forget. 

It takes away so much of your humanity that you're not even sure if you are human anymore. Your skin becomes a mask because your soul died. But I digress.

Yes the law must condone the death penalty but only once it is capable to condone it. As things are now I will not trust the system. But if the system is bettered and we can trust it I will not stand against it. 

But even if this human devil is dead or in prison it doesn't matter because what is done is done. Revenge is not a cure.  The only cure is prevention

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## Justloadit

> People often judge too quickly from my experience.  You've got the one crowd that says no to the death penalty, you've got another crowd that says no to guns....If they are left in the victims shoes, staring down a knife with a criminal on top of them, i bet they wish they had a gun in their hands at that point, and once youve been the victim of serious crimes, like I have, you shout for the death penalty.


Yep can not agree with you more. 
Every member of my family, excluding my two young daughters, have been involved in at least one incident in which a gun was used for robbery. Not a nice situation to deal with the aftermath. It takes a very long time for them to feel comfortable again. One family member was shot and had to nurse the gun shot wounds on two occasions.

Yes to death penalty

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## Justloadit

> But even if this human devil is dead or in prison it doesn't matter because what is done is done. Revenge is not a cure.  The only cure is prevention


Yes but we will reduce the number of evil doers on the planet.

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tec0 (29-Nov-13)

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## tec0

> Yes but we will reduce the number of evil doers on the planet.


Like I said, I am all for the death penalty as long as it is done the right way and without corruption.

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## adrianh

I think that the perpetrator should be handed over to the community for them to sort out. If they choose to apply the death penalty then that's great....

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## HR Solutions

It works in Saudi Arabia

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## Dave S

I would love to see the return of the "Public Guillotine" or "Public Hanging", there would be no greater deterrent to a criminal than to watch as someone's head rolls into a basket, or to watch as a "Friend" swings and chokes at the end of a rope. This should be for any and all violent crimes. But we would need a justice system that works, not the current circus we have. With the current justice system, I would be against a death penalty, it would simply give the cANCer an eradication outlet.

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## Dave A

> I think that the perpetrator should be handed over to the community for them to sort out. If they choose to apply the death penalty then that's great....


Like this?

35-year-old rape suspect stoned to death

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## pmbguy

I would like to shed some light on the subject by looking at how many countries worldwide still have the death penalty. Here is a list (It may be incomplete)

	Afghanistan
	Bahamas
	Bangladesh
	Belarus
	Botswana
	China
	Cuba
	Egypt
	Guatemala
	India
	Indonesia
	Iran
	Iraq
	Japan
	North Korea
	South Korea
	Lebanon
	Malaysia
	Pakistan
	Russia
	Saudi Arabia
	Singapore
	Somalia
	Suriname
	Syria
	Taiwan
	Tajikistan
	Tonga
	United Arab Emirates
	United States
	Vietnam
	Yemen

It is clear from reading this list that these countries are mostly 3rd world countries, with the exception of a few. Some of these countries will in the not so far future abolish the death penalty. There has been a worldwide trend against capital punishment in the last 50years or so.

The US is the last great western democracy that still uses the death penalty. 32 US states use it and 18 have abolished it. In 2012 a total of only 43 inmates were executed.

Searching the internet I have found very little support for the death penalty. I have also found very little evidence that supports the notion that the death penalty reduces violent crime. 
 In Canada, for example, around three murders were committed per every 100,000 people before the death penalty was abolished in 1976, while after that the rate consistently went down reaching 1.85 homicides per 100,000". 
http://www.math.dartmouth.edu/~lampe...ent%20edit.htm

A large amount of murders in SA are directly the result of crime. Whereas in many other countries (especially first world) many murders that occur are crimes of passion, not directly related to crime per se as the motive. In SA we obviously also have many murders due to "crimes of passion" but we have far more crime related murders. I believe that evidence found in other countries that the death penalty does not deter crime, does not really apply  to SA. I feel that the death penalty would certainly change the mindset of criminals, in that they would think twice before actually pulling the trigger. We may not get a massive decrease in crime, but we would definitely see a decrease in the number of violent crimes that lead to murder.

Naturally my biggest concern is that some people may be innocently executed. This risk may be reduced by having very strict criteria relating to specific kinds of evidence needed to deliver a verdict in favour of execution. But even then innocent people will get executed. Perhaps it is one of those things where the means justify the ends. 

I think that it is wrong to kill, but if killing a few people leads to many more people not being killed, then I feel it morally justifiable. 


I think that rapists and child molesters should be castrated by the local vet. I say vet because they deserve to be treated like the animals they are.

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## tec0

> I would love to see the return of the "Public Guillotine" or "Public Hanging", there would be no greater deterrent to a criminal than to watch as someone's head rolls into a basket, or to watch as a "Friend" swings and chokes at the end of a rope. This should be for any and all violent crimes. But we would need a justice system that works, not the current circus we have. With the current justice system, I would be against a death penalty, it would simply give the cANCer an eradication outlet.


Be careful what you wish for. Beheading is not the death penalty you would want. There other things connected to this type of execution that will have a serious domino effect. See the *sociological* aspect of this execution is profound so much so that it started a rebellion and effectively rewrote history. Overpowering someone with this type of fear will be effective to stop horrible crime to a degree BUT it can also spark other side effects such criminals going all out...  

 I recommend the needle, it is fast and you dont have to clean up and face things like blood born diseases. Also the psychological aspect is far worse than that of beheading. 

See beheading is a bloody mess and blood triggers testosterone, aggression and anger like you see in chickens In shot they go crazy and in humans the same happens and you get anarchy. The needle gives an image of absolute powerlessness and psychologically pacifying the criminal mind thus they will fear it more       

sociologically people will be more passive...

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## HR Solutions

So you actually run around with no head ......




Absolutely crap ..... The human body does not react like a chicen !

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## tec0

> So you actually run around with no head ......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Absolutely crap ..... The human body does not react like a chicen !


Well I could search for the video on Youtube where the sniper took out a human with a large sniper rifle. The bottom half of his body was still running when the top half was missing but you dont watch videos so it will be a waste of time. 

But you know everything so the hell with it hey. I really wish you would just pi$$ off.

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## pmbguy

> this execution is profound so much so that it started a rebellion and effectively rewrote history.


I can only assume that you are referring to the French revolution. The guillotine started a rebellion?....LOL. The guillotine was used extensively during the French revolution and became one of its symbols. BUT by no stretch of the imagination can anybody say that it started the rebellion/revolution.   

I can just imagine your “reasoning” here. Flashes of the Revolution Flashes of the Guillotine Blood Blood Guillotine Revolution........Conclusion: The French revolution was caused by the guillotine....guillotine causes rebellion...guillotine bad, where is my bong?

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## tec0

> I can only assume that you are referring to the French revolution. The guillotine started a rebellion?....LOL. The guillotine was used extensively during the French revolution and became one of its symbols. BUT by no stretch of the imagination can anybody say that it started the rebellion/revolution.   
> 
> I can just imagine your reasoning here. Flashes of the Revolution Flashes of the Guillotine Blood Blood Guillotine Revolution........Conclusion: The French revolution was caused by the guillotine....guillotine causes rebellion...guillotine bad, where is my bong?


Really ok let me post this here then https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Revolution




> The Committee of Public Safety came under the control of Maximilien Robespierre, a lawyer, and the Jacobins unleashed the Reign of Terror (17931794). According to archival records, at least 16,594 people died under the guillotine or otherwise after accusations of counter-revolutionary activities.[72] A number of historians note that as many as 40,000 accused prisoners may have been summarily executed without trial or died awaiting trial.[72][73]
> 
> On 2 June 1793, Paris sections  encouraged by the enragés ("enraged ones") Jacques Roux and Jacques Hébert  took over the Convention, calling for administrative and political purges, a low fixed price for bread, and a limitation of the electoral franchise to sans-culottes alone.[74] With the backing of the National Guard, they managed to persuade the Convention to arrest 31 Girondin leaders, including Jacques Pierre Brissot. Following these arrests, the Jacobins gained control of the Committee of Public Safety on 10 June, installing the revolutionary dictatorship.[75]
> 
> On 13 July, the assassination of Jean-Paul Marat  a Jacobin leader and journalist known for his bloodthirsty rhetoric  by Charlotte Corday, a Girondin, resulted in further increase of Jacobin political influence. Georges Danton, the leader of the August 1792 uprising against the King, undermined by several political reversals, was removed from the Committee and Robespierre, "the Incorruptible", became its most influential member as it moved to take radical measures against the Revolution's domestic and foreign enemies.[75]
> 
> Meanwhile, on 24 June, the Convention adopted the first republican constitution of France, variously referred to as the French Constitution of 1793 or Constitution of the Year I. It was progressive and radical in several respects, in particular by establishing universal male suffrage. It was ratified by public referendum, but normal legal processes were suspended before it could take effect.[76]

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## tec0

pmbguy I cannot believe to what extend you would backstab someone to impress  your friends. But this is the last time you get to backstab me.

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## pmbguy

LOL

Your copy & paste shows how the guillotine was used by the revolutionaries against people they viewed as being a threat to the revolution. The guillotine did not start the revolution, not even close. So how do you view your post (copy & paste) as evidence that the guillotine started the revolution when it clearly shows how it was used by the revolutionaries? Nowhere does your post, or any history book, mention that the guillotine started the French revolution. 

It’s a failure of logic and knowledge/understanding on your part 

The guillotine was used extensively as an “effect” of the revolution, not as a cause of the revolution. Stated differently: The revolution started first then the guillotine was used by the revolutionaries to excess.

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## pmbguy

You use the term backstabbing for any post that challenges your argument. 

So according to your understanding of backstabbing I present another knife.




> Well I could search for the video on Youtube where the sniper took out a human with a large sniper rifle. The bottom half of his body was still running when the top half was missing


Without a head you may get a few steps, BUT without a spinal cord (Top half of the body) the legs aint going nowhere. This kind of stuff only happens in movies

I dont mean to be mean Tec, but I cant ignore your propensity for talking nonsense.

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## HR Solutions

Tec for interest sake - it doesn't happen like that ........ Just saying. It was photoshopped.

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## tec0

Over 17,000 people were officially tried and executed during the Reign of Terror, and an unknown number of others died in prison or without trial. But according to you this played no role at all... Nah I think you are just full of it... 

But you know everything so screw it...

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## HR Solutions

No not from a video - from actual experience.

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## pmbguy

Let’s clarify. You said that the guillotine led to the rebellion (referring to the French revolution). 


> this execution is profound so much so that it started a rebellion and effectively rewrote history.


I am deputing your statement that the guillotine started the revolution. I am not disputing its heavy use during the revolution. For some reason you view the use of the guillotine as a cause of the revolution. This is incorrect. You seem to have some trouble with the concept of cause and effect. The rebellion was not started because of the use of the guillotine. The guillotine was used by the revolutionaries to excess only after the revolution started.

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## tec0

> See beheading is a bloody mess and blood triggers testosterone, aggression and anger “like you see in chickens” In shot they go crazy and in humans the same happens and you get anarchy. The needle gives an image of absolute powerlessness and psychologically pacifying the criminal mind thus they will “fear it more”





> No not from a video - from actual experience.


I don't know what happens to the body but when in motion and being hit by a Barrett M82 I can imagine that it does a lot of damage. Also I can imagine that if the body is in motion that it will remain in motion for a few seconds. That was the video that was emailed to me. Also the Barrett M82 only entered into service in 1989. I can’t recall us "South Africa" having something like that so sorry you are talking kak yet again. 

You said I wrote that we "humans" react like headless chickens when decapitated. There is the quotation above please read it again and tell me and everyone else where I wrote that? 




> So you actually run around with no head ......
> Absolutely crap ..... The human body does not react like a chicen !


Above is your story. Thus it is clear you made up a story claim that I wrote it “and I didn’t” and now you want to argue about it? Why? What is your intention? Why create a situation that will only lead to conflict?

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## pmbguy

The guillotine did NOT cause the French revolution. If you can find evidence that states explicitly that it did, then I will apologise and burn my history books. 

I find your response to my posts rather amusing. Instead of dealing with the topic at hand you simply cry about how I dont read your links (which I do by the way) and piss on everything you say etc. The interesting part is that you then try and get away from your own statement by making it more general in nature 



> So are there arguments on the net that state that mass execution prompted a revolutionary change? Yes there is.


Here you are trying to find a more defensible position.

But remember you stated this, and this is the statement we are talking about


> this execution is profound so much so that it started a rebellion and effectively rewrote history.


It is clear that you would rather claim victim status than admit that perhaps you dont know everything. You are incapable of accepting that you can be wrong about something. 

You view a response that disagrees with you as an attack, instead you should consider the possibility that the other person might be correct. You need to learn some humility and understand that just because you believe something it does not necessarily make it true.

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HR Solutions (01-Dec-13)

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## adrianh

@pmbguy - are you using reason and logic - sis on you, how dare you do that. 

Now here is a thought, if the guillotine caused the French Revolution then it stands to reason that the cross caused Christianity...

As an interesting aside: if Jesus had his head lobbed off using  guillotine would all Christians be walking around with little guillotines around their necks?

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## tec0

> The guillotine did NOT cause the French revolution. If you can find evidence that states explicitly that it did, then I will apologise and burn my history books. 
> 
> I find your response to my posts rather amusing. Instead of dealing with the topic at hand you simply cry about how I don’t read your links (which I do by the way) and piss on everything you say etc. The interesting part is that you then try and get away from your own statement by making it more general in nature 
> 
> 
> Here you are trying to find a more defensible position.
> 
> But remember you stated this, and this is the statement we are talking about
> 
> ...


In the end there where a few factors granted. Not saying that I am wrong. See if did any kind of research you will find the words "The Reign of Terror" Now what happened in this time frame? You are the expert you tell me. 

Secondly the idea behind my post was to illustrate that exposing people to acts of horror will have a profound effect on them. Sometimes people go mad “example would be people that come back from war” Some can put what happen behind them others can’t. Not every person is the same.

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## adrianh

tec0 - there comes a time in life when one is better off just keeping quiet irrespective of being wrong or right because further talk adds no value to a situation...

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## tec0

> tec0 - there comes a time in life when one is better off just keeping quiet irrespective of being wrong or right because further talk adds no value to a situation...


 get me on the live chat we can talk about it there. I have an hour we can try and resolve this or not choice is yours.

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## pmbguy

> In the end there where a few factors granted. Not saying that I am wrong. See if did any kind of research you will find the words "The Reign of Terror" Now what happened in this time frame? You are the expert you tell me.


I have actually read extensively about the French revolution, it’s fascinating. 

Yes there was a reign of terror in France during the French revolution. I never said anything to dispute that. The guillotine was used to kill thousands of people, I never disputed that. 

But again you are trying to sidetrack the argument by playing the victim. You stated that the guillotine caused the French revolution, I stated that it did not. It was used in the “reign of terror” only after the revolution was well on its way. 




> Not saying that I am wrong


You are totally wrong

Don’t see this as a personal attack, I would have corrected anybody who held your incorrect view on the matter.

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## adrianh

there is no need for private debate. Keep to the topic at hand within the forum.

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## pmbguy

I think that the Guillotine is the perfect execution device. It is a painless death, the entire procedure is quick. It requires relatively little expertise to use. It is relatively cheap and totally reusable, it needs very little maintenance and it is mobile. It is also tried and tested, with an extremely low fail rate. 

Another added bonus of using such a machine is that it will be feared much more than say an injection would, because you head gets chopped off. The fear alone of having your head removed if you commit murder will definitely make anybody think twice before they pull the trigger on somebody.

The one negative that I foresee is that some religions, like the Rastafarian religion, believe a person must die whole in order to reach the afterlife. In such examples the person should have the option of another method. This in itself may be problematic since those who don’t want to get chopped may convert to one of these religions during death row.

Despite some issues, like the example above, I think it is the most appropriate method of execution. It actually gives me the creeps, which is good because I fear it and that is exactly what it should do. People should fear being under the blade.

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## ians

I think it would be a lot better and more stress relieving if you could stone people to death, especially if the crime was on a family member, or better still if the relatives could beat the criminal to death with whatever device they feel would take the longest and inflict the most pain, without the person passing out, until death, or if the family members are not barbarian enough themselves they could hire the services of someone who gets satisfaction from it. It would have to be a public event for all to see, so that criminals get to see and fear their fate other wise it is a waste.

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## pmbguy

Shit Ian you hardcore, but I understand, especially given what happened to your family. Personally I would make sure the FU**** gets off and does not go to jail. Pay a cop to lose the docket etc. Then I would pedantically set up a plan to take care of him personally, a nice long walk in the bush during a rain storm.  



I think that executions should be done in a way that the prison population witnesses it. This way you get to target those who are most likely to commit murder and end up under the blade themselves. In fact I would have the executions in a giant modified hall where I can safely fit in as many prisoners in as possible. 

I don’t think that executions should be public (outside of the prison population). I certainly would not want my daughter to see an execution.

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## ians

I think it should be public and a small fee charged, it would be a get rich quick scheme, people love to see stuff like this. Don't say they don't, whenever there is an accident everyone slows done to see if they can see something and then when they do they go ooooh F^&* I didn't want to see that, but they actually did that's why they slow down in the first place. Like the old Gladiator days, people loved all the killing.

In saying that, I don't believe young children should be allowed to view it.

By the way PMB, I spent almost 20 months in a bush war and then 9 months in the townships (what a waste of my youth), it not about my family. However in saying that, just reading some of the murder cases and torture people have to endue, it wouldn't be difficult punishing those kind of criminals.

One bonus about crime in this country, you will notice in certain cases they seem to resist arrest, end up in a shootout with well trained people who don't miss.

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## pmbguy

Shoot 4 times. Double in the chest, once in the head then once in the air as a warning shot.

You know I used to hunt, but it lost its lustre a bit. But I would make an exception to bag myself a good tsotsi specimen.

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## pmbguy

> I think it should be public and a small fee charged.


That’s actually a brilliant idea, the whole thing can pay for itself.

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## ians

Never shoot a person more than twice, otherwise you gona need a very good lawyer and a lot of money. Maybe go 15 rounds instead you could get a job as the chief of police or even better, shoot everything you have and become the Independent Police Investigative Directorate.

Judges don't like excessive of anything, unless you are well connected.

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## wynn

> Now here is a thought, if the guillotine caused the French Revolution then it stands to reason that the cross caused Christianity...
> 
> As an interesting aside: if Jesus had his head lobbed off using  guillotine would all Christians be walking around with little guillotines around their necks?


And the killing of 'Mpimpi's' with a burning tyre around their necks started a democracy? shouldn't cANCer members have little tyres around their necks?

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## pmbguy

> And the killing of 'Mpimpi's' with a burning tyre around their necks started a democracy? shouldn't cANCer members have little tyres around their necks?


But Wynn they already have tyres around their necks, caused by the large amount of fat deposits from all the bucket feasts

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## adrianh

> And the killing of 'Mpimpi's' with a burning tyre around their necks started a democracy? shouldn't cANCer members have little tyres around their necks?


For sure: They should call it: their Saint Winnie medallion

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## Dave S

> ...have to clean up and face things like blood born diseases...


This would probably be the biggest problem with "Public Beheading", the guys who clean up would probably be working for the government anyway, so the clean up will take years...

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## Dave S

Whatever method, the death penalty should return, and it should be public. We could have a TV program "The Death Scrolls" with one of those "not for sensitive viewers..." (you know you're gonna watch it anyway) messages, and broadcast all "death sentence events" on all channels, with repeats every 2-hours and all day Friday, so that these criminal bastards know we want their blood... :Devil2:

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## Jacques#1

This wont happen as long as the current government is in power, theyll never go for it, half of them would be fearing for their lives?? :Stick Out Tongue:

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## flumpty

> I would love to see the return of the "Public Guillotine" or "Public Hanging", there would be no greater deterrent to a criminal than to watch as someone's head rolls into a basket, or to watch as a "Friend" swings and chokes at the end of a rope. This should be for any and all violent crimes. But we would need a justice system that works, not the current circus we have. With the current justice system, I would be against a death penalty, it would simply give the cANCer an eradication outlet.


You got it right. If you give the ANC a gallows they might get too fond of using it...

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## gac

Its not even a debate. Bring back the DP and lets start dealing with the "madness" of rape and murder like we mean we are not going to tolerate it.

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## dix

> I would love to see the return of the "Public Guillotine" or "Public Hanging", there would be no greater deterrent to a criminal than to watch as someone's head rolls into a basket, or to watch as a "Friend" swings and chokes at the end of a rope. This should be for any and all violent crimes. But we would need a justice system that works, not the current circus we have. With the current justice system, I would be against a death penalty, it would simply give the cANCer an eradication outlet.



Death penalty would be perfect for brutal people but when considering the human error involve in all justice systems, human life cannot be put at risk to such errors.

Would say for justice system to bring down the stats of such brutal people; must invest more in tackling the root cause of such attacks rather than killing people whom we don't know what's driving them.

Just think about it; there are dude's out-there who rape woman knowing very well the penalty for such, but when in prison, they cannot live up to jail-time rather choose to take their own lives, now why would they fear death penalty (they don't fear death), and should we kill such rapist what will guarantee us that others will not not come up because we didn't solve the real causes,

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## wynn

An interesting case in East London a few years ago where a pregnant girl was stabbed in a hi-jacking and lost the child and nearly her own life.
The mother of the baby's father was all over the newspaper calling for the return of the death penalty, no punishment was too harsh etc. etc.

Turns out the hi-jacking was a set up and the son, the father of the now deceased baby, was involved!!!

We never heard from the mother again.

You must be careful what you wish for.

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