# Interest group forums > Energy and Resource Conservation Forum >  energy saving ideas

## murdock

dave this has become a big topic...like load shedding.

why not start a thread for this and people can input thoughts and ideas

ways to t save not only electricity but energy.

examples:

most common one lately is to switch off tv...PC or electrionic devices.


motion sensors for lighting
especially in huge parking lots where i have heard lots of people complaining about shopping centres which leave huge amounts of lighting burning all night


reducing light levels for example in a conference room if you only need 100 lux dim them to the correct level...and fit motion sensors so when nobody is in the room the light will auto matically switch off.
another place i found this an issue is in large commercial and office blocks...you go into the changeroom/toilet they have like 20 lights at about 500 lux so you can have a widdle...mate its not that small that i need to find it :Big Grin:  

a/c unit pumping all day long in office blocks and shops with no air curtains so the cold air just pumps out the front door...windows left open

only running your pool pump and other non essential items during off peak periods 

after boiling  the kettle put the water in a flask to keep it hot for later use.

all those little things which where requested during load shedding and more


it just goes on and on.

the most important thing about energy saving is you need to commit so that it becomes a lfe style like going to gym every second day eating the correct food etc

lets hear your views.

and like anything there are all the energy saving experts out there who promise to fit devises to save you millions like power factor correction units domestic ones now nogal...beware...makes sure you understand what you are fitting otherwise it becomes like the exercise bike or the tread mill standing in the garage or up for sale at cash convertors for less than a 10 th of the price you paid for it.

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Dave A (31-Jul-09), desA (08-May-10)

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## murdock

power factor correction units.

they are expensive...an example to replace one 50 kvar 440 volt unit capacitor could cost you nearly R5000 per unit to replace.

they do not always save you money....the installation and maintenance cost sometime out weighs the return on investment.

in this country you dont get penalties for low Power factor.

you need an expert to advise you on these units and do at least  a 30 day recording at 15 - 30 intervals or a minimum of a bussiness cycle.

sometime there is electronic metering on site so information can be downloaded from the meter if the person has the correct equipment 

harmonics sometimes effect PFC units negatively.

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## murdock

the next step is lighting...

do you fit a t8 or t5 or an LED 

new technology is great...lighting is becoming as technical as power quality analysing.

in the old days the standard was to fit  400 watt high bay fitting in your factory to give you the best light...mounted at the correct height above 6 metres above finished floor level...a good example of a really bad application is a company in pintown where the light are  installed too low...they look good but thats all they do...they generate alot of heat so i feel for the people who work under them and they waste energy because if installed correctly could have reduced the quantity...now if the person who designed the installation had used his head he would have rather used t5 fittings...

the application...the building frame is low.
they dont get hot because they have electronic ballast... not wire wound and they dont flicker when they start...they start instanaeously.
the lamps have built in reflectors...so they light is not wasted in the black hole above the fittings.
they consume a minimul amount of electricity.

the only down fall is they generate harmonics if the correct filter are not used and they contain small amount of mercury which becomes a problem when disposing of them...especially large quanitites...for example if you do a lamping exercise where you replace all the lamps after a 5 year period...to improve overall lighting.


Led are becoming the way of the future...phillips has a 7 watt led lamps which they offer about 45000 hrs of lamp life to replace the old 12 volt downlights...i have been spending some time looking into these lamps because in a building which has lets say 500 12voltx 50 watt  downlights = 25000 watts...you can save a by installing 7 watt units = 3500 watts and the beuty is you scrap the 12 volt transformer which in turn reduces heat...and maintence costs.

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Converter (04-May-10), desA (08-May-10), Jacques#1 (06-May-10)

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## Dave A

We've had a few clients asking for a quote to retrofit with LED light fittings - certainly seems to be gaining momentum, although at this point budget constraints are an issue.

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## murdock

something else which makes an impact on energy saving is shading around the building.

the less heat on the windows the less the A/C unit has to pump to keep the office cool.

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## murdock

> We've had a few clients asking for a quote to retrofit with LED light fittings - certainly seems to be gaining momentum, although at this point budget constraints are an issue.


there are certain points which need to be noted before rushing out and fitting led lamps...the luminars compared to a 12 v x 50 watt are marginal...so you could find yourself with a dark room in comparison if not designed correctly...oops i made this error a couple of years ago when i installed 12v 50 watt lamps...i didnt take into consideration the height of the room...it was like going into a cave...the atmosphere was great but not adequate for an office enviroment :Big Grin:  yeah yeah i know some people think i am a know it all but believe me i make lots of mistakes and get chopped off at the knees often...but i live and learn :Big Grin: 

Led are not dimmerable at this point in time...i know the next batch of LED from phillips will be...i also dont know at this point if the conventional dimmer will work with the new LED lamps you might need to replace the dimmer currently installed...still new to us.

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## Converter

> the next step is lighting...
> 
> do you fit a t8 or t5 or an LED 
> 
> new technology is great...lighting is becoming as technical as power quality analysing.
> 
> in the old days the standard was to fit  400 watt high bay fitting in your factory to give you the best light...mounted at the correct height above 6 metres above finished floor level...a good example of a really bad application is a company in pintown where the light are  installed too low...they look good but thats all they do...they generate alot of heat so i feel for the people who work under them and they waste energy because if installed correctly could have reduced the quantity...now if the person who designed the installation had used his head he would have rather used t5 fittings...
> 
> the application...the building frame is low.
> ...


I am selling a retrofit solution that converts a T8 fitting to a T5 fitting manufactured by Hyundai. It saves 50% on electricity and has very low mercury content but puts out 30% more light. My site is www.conversionlighting.com. regards,
Steve.

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## Jacques#1

There are newer more powerfull LED lights on the market.  High powered LED's.  The amount of light emitted as aposed to the original LED's that you still buy in a Builders or wherever is day and night.  The problem with this technology as all technology in the beginning of its cycle is expense/price.  Why pay r300+ for one high powered LED if a 50WGU10 costs R20?  Your payback from electricity and lifecycle is non existent looking at the short term, and long term technology gets cheaper.......

I used the low powered LED's in a house with 50Watt gu10's in the centre of the room.  The people have small children, and they walk around at night, so the low powered LED's @ 8 of them, 1.8Watts they can leave on every night forever (almost), and gives you a beautifull light and is functional if the children walks around, and offers good security since you can see the SOB standing on the other side of the room.  If they need light in the room, they switch on the 50W x 8gu10 for the time needed....

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## Jacques#1

I went to the Danish energy conference a few years back held in SA.  Was looking for some literature on a specific piece, but they removed the slides where they spent a year in SA looking at government energy usage.  The purely looked switching off the municipal building lights at night, that all (we aren't even talking about sensors for movement, or timers, or daylight sensors, we are talking about one guy who walks to the board and switches off the Button)

Energy savings through behavioural changes in South Africa
Edenvale Customer Care Centre
Office building
Built ca. 1965
Floor area 6100 m2
3Â½ storeys
205 kWh/m2/year

300 Customer Care Centres in the same size as Ekurhuleni Customer Care Center in Edenvale, will give the following savings per year, when 60% of the savings potential are utilised.

Savings in kW/anno: 130 GigaWatt
Savings in ZAR/per annum at 0.6 rand per Kwh.:  78 mill. Rand
In addition, one can expect similar savings in the same type of public buildings.

They used, looking at the graphs, between 75kW and 140kW between the hours of 6pm and 6am...WHAT A JOKE!!! THIS WAS ONE BUILDING!!!  Yet, the general public, sitting at home is told to switch off their lights.  Consider the fact that this is only municipalities, and not all government buildings, and no private or listed companies?

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Dave A (06-May-10), desA (08-May-10)

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## braganza

The use of Motor Protection units which have the built in functionality of data logging can enable an electrical engineer to determine and optimise the usage of power on each engine running in a factory.  S Tech Africa supplies these units and has had encouraging results from them in using them as a diagnostic tool to reduce power utilisation.

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## Sunfor

> the next step is lighting...
> 
> do you fit a t8 or t5 or an LED 
> 
> new technology is great...lighting is becoming as technical as power quality analysing.
> 
> in the old days the standard was to fit  400 watt high bay fitting in your factory to give you the best light...mounted at the correct height above 6 metres above finished floor level...a good example of a really bad application is a company in pintown where the light are  installed too low...they look good but thats all they do...they generate alot of heat so i feel for the people who work under them and they waste energy because if installed correctly could have reduced the quantity...now if the person who designed the installation had used his head he would have rather used t5 fittings...
> 
> the application...the building frame is low.
> ...


Hi Guys,
for all your lighting needs whether it be a T8-T5 retrofit conversion or all superior Cree LED lighting talk to us. we cater with proper lighting solutions that will give equivalent or in some caes better lighting in LED and not the cheap and nasty stuff that doesnt deliver. Our web is www.sunfor.co.za. regards, shannon

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## murdock

here is an interesting exercise i did last week...i took my lux meter and walked thru a factory...and found some realy interesting facts...not thumb suck calculations...actuall readings...to my horror i found that the lux levels in the factory were between 50 lux and 300 lux...now the only reason i could come up with was that the lamps were older than others...you could see what looked like new lamps gave a reading of around 300 lux 5 metres affl...where as the older lamps where only 50 lux...mmm this got me thinking how important it is to carry out regular lux surveys...not only would the company get int a whole lot of trouble because it effects the workers eye sight...but the general look of the factory...what a waste of electricity if your lights are not producing at least 80-90 % efficency.

i took a new 80 watt double fluorescent and hung it at 4 metres off he ground and plugged it in....woooow i got a reading of 700 almost 800 lux and the joke the tubes are tiny thin little ones...i have just found the perfect light solution for future factory lighting projects.

and to replace any 400 highbay fittings where people want to save money.

when i had the fitting on the ground i took it and lit up across the factory and all i can say is wow...one of the contractors who i know have just installed a whole warehouse full of these fittings the problem was the height 13 + metres and i am told they worked out perfectly...i will take a look as soon as i can get a gap.

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## murdock

> The use of Motor Protection units which have the built in functionality of data logging can enable an electrical engineer to determine and optimise the usage of power on each engine running in a factory.  S Tech Africa supplies these units and has had encouraging results from them in using them as a diagnostic tool to reduce power utilisation.


cost per unit and more details about the the product.

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## AndyD

One of the biggest energy wasting issues with motors is the specifying of oversized motors or the replacing of correctly spec'd motors with a larger one when people want to 'play it safe'. Motors are at their most efficient when running at their maximum load capabilities. An oversized motor can be 20% less efficient than a correctly sized motor whilst doing exactly the same work so using the right motor for the right job can save a fortune over the years in electricity costs.

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## murdock

much like a diesel generator...i have heard of plenty of issues with genarators because people have over spec'd them...just in case.

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## murdock

i found this site interesting....thought i would share it.


http://www.powersaving.co.za/

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## billliu210

This website is interesting and useful. 

According to a data, home electricity consumed by generating hot water is more than 50%, so how to save the energy ? Heat pump can help you, which can save you energy up to 50%-75% ! Moreover, ESKOM is provide a rebate R3660.0-R4236.0 ( If a home owner purchases a heat pump and converts their existing 150L or 200L electric hot water tank they get a R 3,660.00 rebate (approx $US 488.00).  if the homeowner has an electric tank larger than 200L then he gets R 4,236.00 (approx $US 564.00).  

Good news to all of us.

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## murdock

during my experiment i have come to realise a few things which are not quite as i  expected...trying to figue out where the 32 000 litres of water i am consuming a months is going.

had words on many occasions with the boss lady in the house about running deep baths to soak in...water and geyser cost etc.

well truth is if your washing machine runs as often as mine does and is a 7 kg plus top loader...best you start by cutting back on this becuase after doing a few runs from the pool to the machine to fill it i realised that the machine consumes between 50 and 70 litres of water per cycle

1 wash = 50 lt
rinse = 50 lt 
softner = 50lt 

total 150 lt being conservative x that by 4 a day...starts adding up = 600 lt per day x 6 days a week and more sometimes on the weekend...with babies bedding 

worrying about what we as a family are consuming is far out weighed by the amount of electricity and water the maid is consuming on a daily basis...eeeish there is no holding back when it comes to

 cooking on the stove all day...

washing machine running all day...

iron going 5 days a week..

hot water for washing floors...dishers...anything...it seems the hot water taps runs during the day.

if you have a home phone boy best you be coding it...the last maid we had ran up a R1000 plus bill in the little time she spent here...to cellphones.

so just a tip for those people out there making an effort to conserve energy...

best you take the time to educate the domestic...

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## adrianh

Have you considered how much energy is used to manufacture and ship those panels

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## ians

Tinting the windows on your house or office is an effective means of keeping the building cool, never thought it was true until i actually worked in a building recently, which had the windows tinted while we wer busy working and the A/C units had not been installed yet.

Reversing the direction of an extractor fan is also a means of bringing in hot air from the roof during winter and sucking the hot air out the room in summer.

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## Sparks

I have just completed the lighting at Williams Hunt Port Elizabeth and am busy at Chev. 100W LEDs, now light up the place at night. Mercury Vapours have mostly been replaced with 85W CFLs'. Those above the hoists, with 200W. All 8' flourescent fittings have been removed. 5 & 4' Phillips are the replacement. 5 & 4' lamps have also been replaced in existing fittings. This will bring about a huge saving. Problem with the lamps though is the poor quality. I have had to exchange boxes full because they do not work. There have been a lot which did not last 2 weeks before blowing too. The fluorescent tubes are not too bad, about 20 duds out of 600+. The CFLs' however are a pain, about 15% duds. No problems getting them exchanged but a lot of time lost :Rant1:

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tec0 (18-Nov-12)

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## Sparks

> i took a new 80 watt double fluorescent and hung it at 4 metres off he ground and plugged it in....woooow i got a reading of 700 almost 800 lux and the joke the tubes are tiny thin little ones...i have just found the perfect light solution for future factory lighting projects.
> 
> and to replace any 400 highbay fittings where people want to save money.
> 
> when i had the fitting on the ground i took it and lit up across the factory and all i can say is wow...one of the contractors who i know have just installed a whole warehouse full of these fittings the problem was the height 13 + metres and i am told they worked out perfectly...i will take a look as soon as i can get a gap.


They are obviously the High Output tubes. You can install them with or without wings(reflector). I put them in the "inspection" area at Chev where they need very good light with the "wings" and at the new fitment centre without the "wings". The reflector makes a huge difference too. They are also available in 54W which is 4' as opposed to the 5' 80W.

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## Krisberg

Reduce your electricity account by skipping the washing machine's pre-wash cycle if your clothes are not particularly dirty. This will use up to 20% less electricity. You can also use one large light bulb instead of a few small ones. One 100-watt light bulb uses less energy and gives off more light than two 60-watt bulb light.

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## Justloadit

> One 100-watt light bulb uses less energy and gives off more light than two 60-watt bulb light.


Rather use an LED lamp, the savings can be as high as 90%, depending on the application.

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## Sparks

> We've had a few clients asking for a quote to retrofit with LED light fittings - certainly seems to be gaining momentum, although at this point budget constraints are an issue.


Taking the Eskom rebate into consideration when getting rid of 50W downlighters, high wattage fluorescent, Mercury Vapour, and Metal Halide lamps does help to bring the cost down.

The Eskom rebate on Heat-pumps and Solar geysers will apparently cease at the end of March 2013, I am not sure about the rebate on lighting yet.

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## ians

Cant wait for the rebates to end, maybe then the prices will become more realistic for the general public.

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## Rock Wood

Refrigerator and freezer doors should seal tightly. Loose seals cause your unit to work harder and use more energy.

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## Solar Ingenieur

In my private apartment I changed following things:

I now use energy-saving lamps
I now have a laptop instead of a PC
All my electrical appliances are in remote controlled electrical sockets, so I can switch them off togehter, when I go sleeping
The radiators are not covered
I shower more than that I bathe
All my water connections have a limit on water flow
I use the microwave when it is useful and I use the stove when it is useful.
You also save more energy using a dishwasher, instead of doing it by hands.

and so on..  :Wink:

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## pmbguy

Guten Abend

I hope all is well in Germania 

I have a question for you..
What is your best “declassified” output spec for small solar panels?

Auf Wiedersehen

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## Solar Ingenieur

Hello,

all is well.  :Smile:  I hope the things are going well here too.
I've no quick answer for that. Are you an installer of solar panels?

Bye

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