# General Business Category > Business Finance Forum > [Question] FNB vs ABSA vs Standard bank

## league_of_ordinary_men

Hi all

I have an business account with FNB and the other day I wanted to purchase an item from an international website and I wanted to use my business cheque VISA card.So I went through all the steps and when I wanted to pay my card didn't work,so I phoned them and found out I had to verify the card with VISA online so I tried but no option was available so I went to my FNB branch so they could help and they informed me that my card can't make international purchases and that I had to open an PERSONAL account and that card will work with international purchases.Now please correct me if I'm wrong but is a business account not suppose to have more "buying power" if you will then an personal account?

Well any why I will be make international payments through that site monthly so I'm thinking of switching to a different bank that will allow me to be able to make my international online purchases.So what bank will be best excluding FNB with regards fee's monthly fee's and restrictions?

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## ians

I applied for a credit card with Standard bank for my business, they told I didn't qualify because my credit rating was too low, so I applied for a personal cheque account and credit card they offered me R40 000 limits. I still don't have a business credit card so now I use my R99 account for literally everything. Just a tip...don't use your credit card to do an eft, they rip a hole so deep in your backside that you can taste it in your mouth.

Something else I learnt, link all your accounts and transfer the funds from your business account into your R99 account, it only cost R4.75 and then all the transaction including efts are free well for me so far, just check the fees, and like I said don't use your credit card to do efts, only swipe it.

I still don't know why people don't offer cash discounts when paying cash.

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## CLIVE-TRIANGLE

> I still don't know why people don't offer cash discounts when paying cash.


I guess because of cash deposit fees and the security risk associated with getting it banked.

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## Blurock

> I guess because of cash deposit fees and the security risk associated with getting it banked.


Good answer - and true. Once its known that you have cash on the premises you become a target.

FNB has an option on their internet banking for you to link the card for VISA online purchases. People at the branches (of all banks) are not always well trained or well informed. He/she probably looked at the computer and saw that your card was not linked. If you have a problem, it may be better to call a business banker. :Big Grin:

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## wynn

I recieved this email from 'EFFENB' the other day, dunno how much use it will be? didn't ring any jangles for me because I already take advantage of what I need to, but I suppose it is worth knowing what else.


"At FNB, we realise that businesses need to know what they are paying for. We carefully review our fee structures and pricing for our business clients each year, making sure that you get the best possible value from our services. 


Easy ways for your business to save on bank charges: 

CURRENT WAY OF BANKING HOW TO BANK MORE COST-EFFECTIVELY 


 Cash deposits 

 1) Every month I deposit R5000 in cash at
my branch. 

 2) Every month I deposit R60 000 in cash at
my branch. 

 3) Every month I deposit R2-million in cash at
my branch. 

answer 1) Receive payments via EFT (Electronic Funds Transfer), which is more cost-effective and
reduces the amount of cash on your
business premises.
You can also make deposits at FNB ATM
Advance terminals; conveniently available after banking hours. 

answer 2) Receive payments via EFT (Electronic Funds Transfer), which is more cost-effective
and reduces the amount of cash on your
business premises.
Use our FNB Cash Centres to save on your cash deposit fees. 

answer 3) Use our FNB Cash Centres to save on your cash deposit fees.
Our cash-in-transit solutions are convenient
and saves you time as you don't have to go to
a branch. 

 Cash withdrawals 

 4) I withdraw less than R1000 at a time from my branch. 

 answer 4) Use CashBack at point-of-sale devices to withdraw cash, as this service is FREE.
Use your nearest FNB ATM to make your cash withdrawals more cost-effective and convenient. 

 Cheque payments 

5) Make payments 24/7 via Online Banking for Business or eWallet Pro instead of using cheques to save money on cheque processing fees.

 International trading 

6) Make and receive safe payments 24/7 using Top
up and Withdraw with PayPal.

 Transfers 

7) Use Online Banking for Business to make convenient transfers anytime, anywhere and save on transfer costs. 

 Balance enquiries 

8) Use Cellphone Banking or Online Banking for Business for all balance enquiries, as
it is available 24/7 and cheaper than doing it
in branch.

 Statements 

9) Opt to receive your bank statements via email
for FREE."

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## league_of_ordinary_men

Does anyone of you know what the monthly fee's are for a standard bank business account?

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## ians

go to standard bank.co.za then business banking fees

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## IanF

> I recieved this email from 'EFFENB' the other day, dunno how much use it will be? didn't ring any jangles for me because I already take advantage of what I need to, but I suppose it is worth knowing what else.
> 
> 
> "At FNB, we realise that businesses need to know what they are paying for. We carefully review our fee structures and pricing for our business clients each year, making sure that you get the best possible value from our services. 
> 
> 
> Easy ways for your business to save on bank charges: 
> 
> CURRENT WAY OF BANKING HOW TO BANK MORE COST-EFFECTIVELY 
> ...


I Had FNB write to me and say I could save R32 by getting the 2 cheques I deposited converted to EFTs What they don't understand that this is payments by embassies and they don't do electronic payments. Then they phone me and ask what my opinion is of FNB and I tell them the cheque fees and EFT fees are ridiculous because I can't change embassies and when I order small thing like rubber stamps the EFT fee eats the gross margin as it is only 30% on a R100 stamp less a R16.50 EFT fee. 
The question is do they listen?
I know I can get an account and for rubber stamps once a month, but one month I will do 1 next month 5 and then none for 3 months so I prefer to pay when I order.

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## Pap_sak

> I Had FNB write to me and say I could save R32 by getting the 2 cheques I deposited converted to EFTs What they don't understand that this is payments by embassies and they don't do electronic payments. Then they phone me and ask what my opinion is of FNB and I tell them the cheque fees and EFT fees are ridiculous because I can't change embassies and when I order small thing like rubber stamps the EFT fee eats the gross margin as it is only 30% on a R100 stamp less a R16.50 EFT fee. 
> The question is do they listen?
> I know I can get an account and for rubber stamps once a month, but one month I will do 1 next month 5 and then none for 3 months so I prefer to pay when I order.


Open account at Capitec
change one of the 4 free accounts to bank name
run all debit orders and small eft out of that account.
debit orders are R3
EFT's are R1.50

FNB are now (at the ATM) cheaper for cash deposits 
and of course are handy for having a overdraft at very reasonable rates.

I have been operating this "spit" system for a while and save around R300 - R400 p/m - accountant does not seem to mind working of two statements.

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## league_of_ordinary_men

Does capitec have business accounts?

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## Dave A

> Does anyone of you know what the monthly fee's are for a standard bank business account?


Last time I checked (about Jan or Feb this year), running my business bank accounts at Standard Bank worked out over 50% more expensive than if I had operated the same accounts at FNB. So look carefully before you leap.

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## Blurock

> Does capitec have business accounts?


No

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## Pap_sak

> No


Depends what you want. If you are happy with an account in your business name with a unique account number that has it's own statement and you can have debit orders and eft's directly from - then yes, thye have the cheapest business account in SA by far.

It's as basic as they come, but will be fine for many.

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## roryf

> I guess because of cash deposit fees and the security risk associated with getting it banked.


We use G4S to collect some of our cash and they have a banking service where they charge R0.33/R100 deposited.The amount deposited is then transferred to our account via EFT.I do pay an additional fee for them to collect but they basically pay for themselves and it is soo much easier and safer.

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MartinK (03-Sep-13)

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## MartinK

Hi there

After investigating my bank statement for the last 6 months I've come to realize that Standard bank's been charging me R25 every month for some overdraft facility which I am using.  Now according to my knowledge, to be able to use overdraft you must have R0 in  your account which has never been the case.  Just wanted to know if you experience a similar fate as me ?

Kind regards

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## Mike C

I know that some banks charge for allowing you to have an overdraft facility - whether you use it or not.

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## Dave A

Looking at Standard's fee price list, you're the victim of yet another subtle change to Standard's fee structure by the looks of things. It used to be they only charged the overdraft management fee on personal accounts when you actually used the overdraft facility.

Another new one for me kicked in this year when I was converted to one of their package deals - a posted statement fee of R9 per month. And it isn't to be found anywhere on their price list. While I was on pay-as-you-transact, I certainly wasn't being hit with that one. And this little extra charge over and above certainly wasn't mentioned by the banker during discussions on the package deal they were offering either.

Trivial, but somewhat irritating and disappointing nonetheless.

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## MartinK

Ironic actually because I asked the lady that helped me set up this contract if There is any other fees except the R99.  Over and over I she confirmed "No sir, It's only R99 for the elite banking" .., Sigh...Gonna me be and that bank with a couple of boxing gloves this weekend...

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## Justloadit

I know that every year, my business overdraft is renewed, and every time it is renewed I pay a good few grand, as it is a % of the overdraft value. So it seems that Stranded bank is doing it as a monthly charge.

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## roryf

> I know that some banks charge for allowing you to have an overdraft facility - whether you use it or not.


Nedbank does this and they call it a commitment fee.They have to have the money available even if you don't use it, so that is basically what they are charging for.

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## iLLuDeano

I have been with Standard bank since I was a boy, and so was my dad. My mom is with ABSA, and from previous experience she has had much more trouble with there service than my dad has had with the Service from Standards bank. To this day I have not had a single issue with them. As a student I never paid withdraw fees!

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## Justloadit

Been with FNB for years, can also say little problems. Anyway,  this morning I check on my bank statement, R4.10 levied for "#Online payment history", a search I did the day before looking for a creditor I paid to make a new payment in July 2013.

This is now getting ridiculous.

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## Blurock

> Looking at Standard's fee price list, you're the victim of yet another subtle change to Standard's fee structure by the looks of things. It used to be they only charged the overdraft management fee on personal accounts when you actually used the overdraft facility.
> 
> Another new one for me kicked in this year when I was converted to one of their package deals - a posted statement fee of R9 per month. And it isn't to be found anywhere on their price list. While I was on pay-as-you-transact, I certainly wasn't being hit with that one. And this little extra charge over and above certainly wasn't mentioned by the banker during discussions on the package deal they were offering either.
> 
> Trivial, but somewhat irritating and disappointing nonetheless.


Banks are notorious for "slipping in" fees and clauses to a contract that can come back to bite you at a later stage. They will lull you with "these are the standard documents/contract/charges" so that you don't spend the whole day in their offices reading through the fine print and ask silly questions. Nowadays you almost need an attorney to go trough all the fine print.

That is why the NCR has made new rules to protect the consumer. Be aware of your rights and take your time reading through a contract or agreement. If need be, wait until the next day before signing.

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## Justloadit

Some agreements, the bank will not let you take away and bring back.
Any agreement that I sign, I sit and read it to ensure that I accept the T & C's, and if I do not understand something, I never ask them, as their explanation holds no water when there is a dispute, but rather do a google search, or phone a friend/attorney.

9 times out of 10, you will not be able to change the agreement, so you either walk away, or understand the agreement and accept the T & C's and sign. But simply signing with out reading is a cardinal sin!

I have on a number of occasions been able to change one or two clauses, which I felt uncomfortable with. One of those has even been a surety with a bank, where I limited the amount and the amount of collateral to cover the amount. In fact even now after the NCA has been promulgated, many bank sureties have no limit, and cover all dealings with the banks, but if you are wise to this, you inform them before the agreement is drawn up by the bank, to ensure that the agreement is according to the terms negotiated.

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## Blurock

Banks will be more willing to provide finance if they can rely on collateral or a strong surety to back the transaction. This is called "mitigation of risk" but is actually more like pawn broking.

Be careful when signing surety. If you really have to sign, limit the surety to that specific transaction. Get a letter of confirmation from the bank that your surety pertains to that agreement/account only. Should the bank then enter into any further transactions with the borrower, you can not be held liable for those transactions. 

There has been numerous cases where someone has signed an unlimited surety, which is then applied to a totally unrelated borrowing years later, only because the surety was never cancelled after the initial debt was repaid.

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## ians

Talking about surety, I had an interesting visit last week. People arrive at my gate and indicate that they are from Ellerines, doing a routine check to verify that I am in fact the employer of the person who has just purchased goods. They asked me to sign a form to verify I am the employer, they handed me 1 page to sign. I signed and made a note on the document that I will not take responsibility for any outstanding debts incurred by the employee. I requested a copy which they could not give me  but indicated that they would send me a copy, I am still waiting for it. Anyone else had this experience?

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## AndyD

You must be nuts, I'd never sign any document for any department store. I tell them to send me the details they need confirming by email and I just reply saying that they're true or false.

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## ians

I agree, been doing some dumbass things lately, not thinking, too many other things distracting me. I think that's how these people catch you, they just suddenly in your face all sweet and friendly.

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## Justloadit

I take all requests by unknowns as a scam, this automatically triggers my internal warning bells, and usuall state 'No' before they even complete their sentence. Most times they disappaer immediately.

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## ians

It is going to be interesting to see how this plays out.

I have done a little research and apparently it is common practise for shops to investigate and verify place of work. They are loosing lots of money selling furniture to people who don't give them correct information, my only concern is that they try recover the money form me if the domestic doesn't pay. I will be following up and get the documentation and read it this week.

I had an employee who gave my physical address and my telephone number to a company, who are now harassing me, because my number is the number he gave and I get letters of demand by the dozen in my post box with his name on. I opened one to see what it was all about, to find it was a letter of demand for outstanding balances for a variety of companies. We wonder why you pay so much to buy clothing etc at places like Edgars, woolworths, etc, it is to cover all the lost revenue.

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## bjsteyn

> Does anyone of you know what the monthly fee's are for a standard bank business account?


Its R99 per month for the first year. There BizLaunch account.

From Standard Bank website:

_"Introduction

You've taken the first step, decided to start your own business and be your own boss.
Our years of experiences and expertise can help you with this exciting next step.

Do I qualify for a BizLaunch account?

You qualify for a BizLaunch account if you are one of the following:

    An entity, sole proprietor or informal body formed with the intention to do business and generate a turnover
    A start-up business with no other business accounts
    Run an existing business less than 12 months old
    A business trading and using your personal account to transact

Why do I need a BizLaunch account?

BizLaunch account helps you to keep accurate banking records, produces statements for easy reference and assists you to build up a banking relationship and credit risk profile.

Our business account is simple to manage and allows you to transact in the way that is most convenient for you, from traditional branch banking to using our advanced electronic services.

What do we offer?

A BizLaunch account has all the functionality of a standard current account, with a difference! We understand that costs matter when you're starting out. During the early days, cash flow is scarce, so paying a fixed amount for bank charges every month allows you to plan better. For this reason, BizLaunch offers bundled pricing, which means you save on bank fees while your business is starting up.

The account also offers a cheque card, which is your key to doing your banking anytime anywhere. It allows you to:

    Access all our banking channels
    Do your banking on the Internet, by telephone, cellphone and at our AutoBank centres
    Pay for business purchases at merchants displaying the VISA sign. You are able to manage the monthly limits on the cards
    Gives you access to Visa premium business benefits

There's more...

Your BizLaunch transactional account also offers you:

    A merchant device for R325.00 a month at a rate of 3.25% across all card types
    Business registration services
    A business plan template to help you with finance applications
    Classroom-based training at a 20% discount
    Access to BizConnect online portal for business tips
    Access to BizDirect all centre for business support and query resolution

Other benefits...

    Pastel My Business Online Accounting package support to help you to produce management accounts and financial statements
    Business Insurance for R150 per month
    You can deposit and withdraw money whenever required, (subject to the available balance in your account)
    Electronic banking facilities enable you to have access to your bank accounts 24-hours a day, using AutoBank, AutoPlus, internet and telephone banking
    Stop payment instructions on debit orders.
    Money is easily transferable to other Standard Bank branches and other banks
    You can manage the following through internet banking:
    Future dated payments
    Account payments
    Balances and provisional statements
    Inter account transfers

Ready, steady, go!

To activate your account you need an opening deposit of R500. Your business banker will facilitate this for you and get you ready to start transacting.

Bundled pricing

For the first 12 months your pricing bundle includes the following transactions:

    8 ATM cash withdrawals
    Combined total of 30 card purchases electronic account payments
    Unlimited debit orders
    Unlimited inter account transfers
    Unlimited AutoBank deposits
    Unlimited Autobank/Autoplus statements and balance enquiries
    Internet banking subscription
    MyUpdates subscription
    Annual cheque card fee
    Online accounting package monthly license fee

Terms and Conditions:

This offer is valid for a 12 month period starting from the day the Bizlaunch account is opened.

The Bizlaunch account will automatically convert to a bundled BizLaunch pricing of R180 per month on the 12 month anniversary of the account. You will be able to choose to enjoy all of the great benefits of BizLaunch at this competitive rate, or you can elect to move to a Business Current Account with 'pay as you transact' pricing by calling BizDirect.

Contact Us:

For more information speak to a business banker or call the BizDirect call centre on 0860 109 075 or email: bizdirect(@)standardbank.co.za."_

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## bjsteyn

The only thing is Standard Bank doesn't give Business Loans (or at least startup loans) as far as I know. And you can only upload funds to Paypal from FNB (as far as i know). Thats the two reasons my business account is still with FNB and not Standard Bank.

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