# Social Category > General Chat Forum >  They are not that expensive!!!

## tec0

I am writing to you today in hope to that you can take this post to heart. We all have friends that consume alcohol it is nothing new and for the most part harmless. Unless the person gets violent then I would recommend handing them over to the police. 

Other than that I want to tell you how you can save your friends job or even your own job. Also to save lives! Yes it is true zero tolerance policies are enforceable and neither the CCMA nor the Labour Union can save your but if you go to work stone drunk. They can try but it is a long shot at best. 

So I got some of my friends a *breathalyzer* tester. You can get them at pharmacies or gadget shops. They cot between R100 to R350 and a good one can set you back a bit more but for the most part they are not that expensive. I recommend get one and test it at home make sure it works correctly. Best way to test is I find is mouth wash . Also dont test yourself after using mouth wash. Give it a few moments.  

This little device can tell you that you dont belong at work or behind a steering wheel. The alternative is a car accident and or losing your job.  

I few good people lost there jobs over bad decisions... So come on do the right thing get one if you need one or give one if your friend needs one.  :Innocent:  

Choice is yours.    

Be safe!

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## HR Solutions

I think you pretty much know, that if you have had more than two or three drinks, you are over the limit !  What you should be carrying with you all the time is the telephone no of Goodfellows or one of the cab companies so that you can call them to pick you up and take you home.

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## tec0

Agreed. That said you get people that party till they drop and when they wake-up they think they are ok because they cannot remember the amount of alcohol they consumed nor have a good idea on how much time has passed. So there is a true danger that they may drive a car or go to work “still intoxicated” Especially in South Africa we get people that can function normally while they had a few drinks behind them. 

So this is basically just reality check to see that you are ok to drive and go to work. If you are the informed responsible drinker there is always a chance that forgot something so it remains a plus for them to have this device. But it is simply a must have if the person in question is a hardcore drinker.

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## adrianh

I really doubt if a hard-core drinker is to going to blow in the little device and go "Oh my, I'm still p1$$ed, I will just sleep in the bar tonight" or "Oh my, I am still p1$$ed from drinking last night, I will just call in sick today and sleep in"

The point that I am trying to make is that a hard-core drinker is irresponsible to start with, he won't get a taxi every night and he sure wont call in sick every day.

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## pmbguy

I want one just to see how high I can score

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## Dave A

I'm just picturing this:
When an employee calls in and says "Hi boss, not coming in to work today because I'm still over the limit from drinking last night", what am I supposed to say?
Or think for that matter?

 :Hmmm:

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## eina26

Hey teco, your signature kinda ruins everything you wrote.  :Big Grin:

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## Dave S

I'm with Adrian on this one, a hardcore drinker is an irresponsible dragon, or he/she wouldn't be a hardcore drinker in the first place.

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## tec0

Well I know of a few hardcore drinkers that use the device and behold they are still employed. So yes hard core drinkers will use the device because they value there employment otherwise how can they afford their habit?

Secondly these hardcore drinkers acts more responsibly The truth is alcohol takes the time it takes to go through your system but by consuming a meal that consist of heavy proteins will dampen the bodys ability to absorb the alcohol. Also remember that your body produces alcohol naturally in a small amount by adding more in your blood can result in a higher positive reading then the alcohol consumed. 

Mixing your drink behaviour by switching between alcohol and none alcoholic drinks helps the metabolism deal with the alcohol. But normally it comes down to how much you drank and how much time you have between then and the next day. If your body had enough time to deal with the alcohol then the breathalyzer will give you an all clear. 

If not then that pesky stomach flu excuse is always handy and true to a degree as your metabolism will be working overtime to deal with the poison. 

I cant tell you how many hours you need between your last drink and time your body needs to get rid of it because it comes down to the abuse your body had to deal with so again it is a good idea to have this device handy.  It will give you an indication.

But the choice is yours, you can drink responsibly or you dont. But out of experience I know if drinkers have access to such a device they do start to change their behaviour a bit because in the end of the day they need that pay-check.

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## tec0

Just as a side note, some larger corporations started to hand out these devices and really the results were worth it. Less dismissals a notable decline in damage of property are the most prominent factors. The general feedback was also good.

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## tec0

> Hey teco, your signature kinda ruins everything you wrote.


It is there for my protection, 

The benefits of having such a device I believe is obvious however... But you get people that tries to shoot down everything. I don't know why  :No:  

If the post is for you or someone you know than why not take it to heart buy the device “one of your choice” use it or give it to someone that needs it. Really at least you give someone a chance where they normally would have no chance. Also it is a wakeup call from a friend that cares.

Also what is stopping you to Google for facts and make your own informed decision. My intention was to spark an interest. If nothing else someone years from now will go “this sounds like  plan” than I am happy  :Smile:  

As for my Disclaimer it does its job  :Smile:

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## pmbguy

I like the idea of having testers connected to company vehicles, along with the usual tracker system. The car will start if you over the limit for safety reasons, but it will report it, at the same time taking a photo/video and over the car speaker he will hear your (boss) pre recorded warning "Craig see you in the office first thing" or "Think about this Craig....do you want your job?". 
I can also see these devices used on request of patrons at restaurants just before leaving for home, as a special added service. 

But Tec tell me why this topic, what recent event made you think of this, was there an incident?

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## pmbguy

Given the fact that those cheap ones are for one-time use only the market for social use will be extremely limited. 
A proper reusable tester will cost RX000, who is going buy that? Testing Freaks? 
I guess the cheap one will have its place, but will mostly dwell unused in the handbags of control-freak woman modelling around the mall

Tec, give me hypothetical examples of how You would use it.

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## adrianh

You will never get away with putting them in company vehicles. The staff would simply use mouthwash all the time to render them useless.

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## pmbguy

Dam you right, they will do that the bastards. I guess I will have to invent a non-invasive way to get blood, shit then I am screwed again they can get a blood transfusion

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## adrianh

Its just like drug testing, too many substances give false positives for it to be reliable without proper laboratory based testing. A simple one is poppy seeds, they produce a false positive for Opium. Going to be a bit difficult to prosecute a driver for Opium use because he had a Steers burger....Of course in the case of McDonalds you would be able to successfully prosecute him for eating cardboard  :Cool:

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## HR Solutions

So what is going to happen ?  An employee gets pissed all the time, decides to buy a "gadget", uses it in the morning only to find he is over the limit, so reports in sick ?  There is only so many times he can do this with the sick leave he is owed.  Personally I find that if I want to drink "heavily" I would probably really only do it on a Friday night or sat night as I would far rather be this way "responsible".  
I'm not going to buy a blower to be responsible.

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## pmbguy

Think of it this way, when have you ever told yourself "I wish I had a breathalyzer on me, dammit". The occasions when any individual would need one seems a bit narrow. However I don’t see anything wrong with having one as an emergency item in the first aid kit in the car.

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## adrianh

You must remember that some look for solutions within, others look for solutions (outside) (It would actually be more precise to say "Without" ...taking responsibility for the underlying problem to start with) 

It would of course be a lot simpler not to drink excessively, but that would constitute changing the nature of the beast rather than simply sticking a bandaid on its ass!

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## pmbguy

> Of course in the case of McDonalds you would be able to successfully prosecute him for eating cardboard


I could never be employed if they test for macee D! I choose my house based on its proximity to the big mac.

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## HR Solutions

lol .  Yeah I think most of us know within when we are over the limit.  Those gadgets work fine when you want to test an employee or someone else.  (Yes I do know the laws regarding this as well, just in case I am again attacked for it)

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## adrianh

Think laterally, I am referring to the manner in which one looks for solutions to problems, rather than the specific problem!

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## HR Solutions

> Think laterally, I am referring to the manner in which one looks for solutions to problems, rather than the specific problem!


 :Slap:

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## tec0

> I like the idea of having testers connected to company vehicles, along with the usual tracker system. The car will start if you over the limit for safety reasons, but it will report it, at the same time taking a photo/video and over the car speaker he will hear your (boss) pre recorded warning "Craig see you in the office first thing" or "Think about this Craig....do you want your job?". 
> I can also see these devices used on request of patrons at restaurants just before leaving for home, as a special added service. 
> 
> But Tec tell me why this topic, what recent event made you think of this, was there an incident?


I think there are enough drunk drivers running around. I figured if companies small businesses took part in an informal awareness campaign about drunk driving and perhaps hand out a few devices to their employees that there can be an active change on the roads. 

I dont know after seen that truck destroying those taxi busses on the news the image burned into my memory. Yes we all dislike taxi drivers but the people at the back of the taxi didnt ask to die. So based on that I am slowly working on a plan to introduce awareness and in future perhaps even the devices themselves handing them out at stops or at the mall. 

I am still working on the finances for this campaign but hopefully by the end of next year it will become a reality.

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## adrianh

What does that truck accident have to do with drunk driving?

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HR Solutions (26-Sep-13)

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## pmbguy

> Think laterally, I am referring to the manner in which one looks for solutions to problems, rather than the specific problem!


In this case the change from within holds much more bearing to the solution than seeking a solution though something outside of one's self. 
In this case technology is being used as a tool for seeking control. So inner doubt and change seeking behaviour, for the purposes of seeking control, finds a fake outside Panacea.
I only say the word problem now as it applies in earnest, The Problem is the drinking itself (obviously) this is exacerbated by the fake sense of control (tester). Real control in inward then outward, not outward then inward. 2 Problems, 1 Drinking too much 2 Dealing with it by finding fake outside control. 

Also using a tester to save you from some negative effects of alcohol is like having clean needles available for heroin addicts. It does not change the behaviour at all it just removes some negative consequences and adds others.

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## adrianh

Right on...

Toby Keith puts it perfectly in one of his songs "There is no right way to do the wrong thing"

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## pmbguy

> So based on that I am slowly working on a plan to introduce awareness and in future perhaps even the devices themselves “handing them out” at stops or at the mall. 
> I am still working on the finances for this campaign but hopefully by the end of next year it will become a reality.


Man now that I got to see

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## pmbguy

Hey tec0, I will buy you a drink at the launch and at your victory party  :Drunk:

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## HR Solutions

> . I figured if companies small businesses took part in an informal awareness campaign about drunk driving


Most companies do this.  In fact it is quite formal .  From the words of an excellent example (Trump) You're fired !

Personally I am not going to help any staff by giving them a gadget to test themselves.
Then we should give them HIV testing kits to test themselves after they have had a good shag to see if they have been invected so they don't go out there and kill anyone else !
Its all about responsibility again which we spoke about on another thread (and disagreed about) .  Take responsibility for yourself.  Its the same as a pilot.  He knows that if he is flying the next day he is not allowed to drink !! He does not need to blow his gadget to see if perhaps he might be below the limit so its ok to fly !

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## tec0

No the video had nothing to do with drunk driving that time but I have seen more than enough drivers consuming beer while driving not at the club not at home while actually driving their car. 

My thinking started what if we can get people to realise that it is a bad idea. Then one of the largest companies in South Africa handed out breathalyzers to their staff and almost that same week I saw a definite attitude change in some people They keep their devices safe and use them at their homes. 

This showed me that when a person can see right I did sleep I feel better but the little light is still red they asked someone to drive them. This happened and continues to happen. So really that company spend their money wisely. 

Some got themselves a more expensive model and keep it underneath there bar at home. When they see the measurement they stop switch over to none alcoholic drinks and they really put in the effort. 

To your mind this might be a waste of time and money. To my mind what I have seen and was told by friends showed me that people really do want to keep themselves out of trouble. I am not delusional it will not eradicate accidents it will not stop people from drinking and driving. But it will help some people and that is more than good enough for me. 

It comes down to your mindset. You can make it work OR you can ignore it.

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## tec0

> Hey tec0, I will buy you a drink at the launch and at your victory party


I don't consume alcohol... Haven't touch the stuff in years.  :Wink:

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## pmbguy

Tec I know from your previous posts that you don’t really drink allot. So I think that you personally are reasonably responsible when you drink. With this assumed responsibility have you ever really had the need to breathalyse yourself? And would this actually change any event that followed? If it did to which greater good really? I am more speaking about the doubt I have personally as to whether such an effort is good or bad, other stuff like "drunk taxi" will be much more effective. Perhaps put your efforts in another van for the big plan. To stop negative shit caused by alcohol. What do think?

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## pmbguy

> Haven't touch the stuff in years.


Kak man don't lie now hey boet, I bet you clutching a papsak as we speak!  :Cool:

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## tec0

> Most companies do this.  In fact it is quite formal .  From the words of an excellent example (Trump) You're fired !
> 
> Personally I am not going to help any staff by giving them a gadget to test themselves.
> Then we should give them HIV testing kits to test themselves after they have had a good shag to see if they have been invected so they don't go out there and kill anyone else !
> 
> Its all about responsibility again which we spoke about on another thread (and disagreed about) .  Take responsibility for yourself.  Its the same as a pilot.  He knows that if he is flying the next day he is not allowed to drink !! He does not need to blow his gadget to see if perhaps he might be below the limit so its ok to fly !


Actually I can see you have little to no experience when it comes to larger companies. If you did the above post wouldn't exist. Larger companies have personnel that can aid in the test for HIV. The tests is not mandatory for the most part but they highly recommend it because the company needs to know otherwise they cannot protect you against someone with HIV and the person with HIV can't protect there fellow workers and so on.

There are many programs at the moment to help control HIV and other STD's. Companies do try hard to keep there asset "the employee" healthy and safe. After all what if I am employed and I get HIV accidentally at my work place? 

What if my work involves sharp objects what if one of those objects have an infected persons blood on it. What if I used it unknowingly and cut myself? What did you do as a employer to aid in my health and safety. I recall a case at a supply store where one of the employees cut themselves accidentally. So YES it does happen and is one of the main reasons why PPE is so very important and why real and true health and safety is not a joke or a waste of money. 

But if you really want to get technical do your employees use any type of protection against "paper cuts" for example? Don't feel bad if you don't a lot of people don't... But forget the employees just for a moment. What if it is you that get the "paper cut" and you work with the public and someone "you don't know who" have small insignificant injury and oops...  :Confused:  

But some people do take small cuts very seriously, if you Google it you would see why  :Wink:  

As for the device, If I can get it going... "BIG IF" I think it would be cool.

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## tec0

> Kak man don't lie now hey boet, I bet you clutching a papsak as we speak!


How much money are you willing to lose?  :Devil2:

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## pmbguy

Everything!  :Gunsmilie:

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## HR Solutions

******* Sigh ******  tec once again you have read wrong.  I am not talking about what companies do.  I am talking about handing out gadgets !!! Believe me I am totally familiar with the law.

But whatever tec.  If you want to start again, find someone else.  I am just going to take some advice from an esteemed member on this forum and agree with you and say if you want to think you are right then ok YOU ARE RIGHT.

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## tec0

> Everything!


Well then obviously I am not drinking now so YOU LOSE.  :Cool: 

But I dont know if there is a test I can do that will date when last I had a drink? And remember now we are not testing for natural occurring alcohol. Normally the body produces a bit. So do I go to the dock for a blood test first or do I send you my bank account number.

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## tec0

> ******* Sigh ******  tec once again you have read wrong.  I am not talking about what companies do.  I am talking about handing out gadgets !!! Believe me I am totally familiar with the law.
> 
> But whatever tec.  If you want to start again, find someone else.  I am just going to take some advice from an esteemed member on this forum and agree with you and say if you want to think you are right then ok YOU ARE RIGHT.


hehehehe, worried about those "paper cuts" are we.... yea it is evil if you think about it...  :Stick Out Tongue: 

what was that about a good shag and HIV  :Rofl:  

I am just saying  :Cool:  

 :Rofl:   :Rofl:   :Rofl:

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## HR Solutions

Oh yes I am "terrified".

PS.  I really don't give a sh!t to be honest with you.

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## tec0

> Oh yes I am "terrified".
> 
> PS.  I really don't give a sh!t to be honest with you.


lol ag nee shame man don't take it like that... All in good fun... All I am saying is some businesses do others don’t. It’s not a crime... Large businesses as you know spend a hell of a lot of money on training and education so obviously they want the best for their investment.  It is cool to see and I support it. It is cool programs to have...

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## HR Solutions

Every business has certain obligations to their staff and to the community.  Our company is no different.  We recently spent an entire weekend at a Rape Crisis Centre physically refurbishing it and then more.  So personally I really don't give a damn what one or two people do say.  Its not what people think or don't think that matters, it is what you actually do in the workplace and for the community that matters, nothing else !

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## pmbguy

Hey HR did you shag tec0’s girl or something, what is going on between you two? Can’t we all just get along  :Cool:

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## Dave A

> it will not eradicate accidents it will not stop people from drinking and driving. But it will help some people and that is more than good enough for me.


Good enough for me too, frankly. I'm inclined to agree that just having the tool there means some people will use it. Probably quite a few even.

It certainly makes at least as much sense to me than this proposal to ban all alcohol advertising that's currently doing the rounds - probably more so.

Change who you can and understand that at the end of the day the "die-hards" are just that - they're going to need a sledgehammer blow to change their ways.

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tec0 (26-Sep-13)

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## tec0

> Every business has certain obligations to their staff and to the community.  Our company is no different.  We recently spent an entire weekend at a Rape Crisis Centre physically refurbishing it and then more.  So personally I really don't give a damn what one or two people do say.  Its not what people think or don't think that matters, it is what you actually do in the workplace and for the community that matters, nothing else !


Exactly right, you are free to do as you please. I am free to do as I please. It is always good to give your time and effort and sometimes invest in something you believe in. I personally fix old computers make them workable spend my own money on them. I know it be used for games and what not. But there will be people that really use it for education.  That is good enough for me. 

To be inspired to fight the good fight is the best way to brake the cycle. For someone it start with a refuge then an act of understanding and kindness. For someone else it can be a friend that shows they care. 

My motivation “I do it because I can” hehehe why not?  :Cool:

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## tec0

> Good enough for me too, frankly. I'm inclined to agree that just having the tool there means some people will use it. Probably quite a few even.
> 
> It certainly makes at least as much sense to me than this proposal to ban all alcohol advertising that's currently doing the rounds - probably more so.
> 
> Change who you can and understand that at the end of the day the "die-hards" are just that - they're going to need a sledgehammer blow to change their ways.


You can't help everyone but you can help someone and that someone will benefit from it and perhaps help someone else. Who knows but it is worth it I think.  :Yes:

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## ians

What always amazes me is that the cops setup road blocks 5 km away from the pub, there are armed response, tow truck drivers and many other ways to figue out routes to get home without getting caught if you have the right contacts. I can never understand why the booze busses are not setup outside the pub.

If you want to catch drunk people sit outside the restaurant or pub or night club and watch as people walk, stagger to the vehicle.

I did a project many years ago at Alusaf Hillside smelter in RB. Every morning I waited at the gate and greeted every single one of the staff as they walked through the gate, if I suspected that they had been drinking or had not sobered up from the night before, I directed them to the office and gave them the choice take the money and leave or go through a process to determine how sober they where, it worked like a charm. 

I have a mate who does the same thing, still to this day, every morning he walks around the workshop and greets every single person, by doing this he can determine if they have been drinking or if they have problems. Both companies he has worked for, he has managed to improve productivity by at least 40 %. 

Some of the bigger industrial sites it is mandatory to blow in a breathalyser when you get to work.

My opinion, if you need to carry a breathalyser around to determine how drunk you are, maybe you should consider giving up drinking.

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## pmbguy

Banning alcohol advertising is a very very good thing for the health and wellbeing of all. Sport sponsorship might suffer temporarily, some jobs might get lost, but the societal benefit will be in strong evidence especially if you look at long term outcomes, it worked for cigarettes so why not.

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## tec0

> Banning alcohol advertising is a very very good thing for the health and wellbeing of all. Sport sponsorship might suffer temporarily, some jobs might get lost, but the societal benefit will be in strong evidence especially if you look at long term outcomes, it worked for cigarettes so why not.


If SA Breweries are clever they can still sponsor sports even on school level. All they have to do is take the beer out of the water and just sell the water with added goodness... It is not an energy drink just a good clean healthy drink that every child in South Africa can enjoy. 

Same for the adult sports... SAB Water division! Same logo just a added word and there you go. You make millions selling the product keep people healthy happy AND you still get seen on public events. This time mom dad and children each holding a SAB product. 

Think about it...

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## adrianh

Yes, I also think that they shouldn't show images of women because that leads to dancing which leads to lust which leads to sex which leads to STDs and HIV. But thinking about it, they shouldn't show men either because that leads to gay-ness which of course leads to floral shirts which leads to pantyhose which leads to men carrying handbags and driving little pink Mini's.

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Dave A (26-Sep-13)

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## Dave A

> Banning alcohol advertising is a very very good thing for the health and wellbeing of all. Sport sponsorship might suffer temporarily, some jobs might get lost, but the societal benefit will be in strong evidence especially if you look at long term outcomes, it worked for cigarettes so why not.


People still smoke. And we still have youngsters starting to smoke.

Stopping the advertising is no silver bullet. Not exactly useless either, but to my mind, the thing that has probably had the greatest effect in recent times when it comes to smoking has been the heightened awareness of the detrimental health effects and addictive properties of the product.




> Yes, I also think that they shouldn't show images of women because that leads to dancing which leads to lust which leads to sex which leads to STDs and HIV. But thinking about it, they shouldn't show men either because that leads to gay-ness which of course leads to floral shirts which leads to pantyhose which leads to men carrying handbags and driving little pink Mini's.


 :Rofl:

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## HR Solutions

> Yes, I also think that they shouldn't show images of women because that leads to dancing which leads to lust which leads to sex which leads to STDs and HIV. But thinking about it, they shouldn't show men either because that leads to gay-ness which of course leads to floral shirts which leads to pantyhose which leads to men carrying handbags and driving little pink Mini's.


Ek se ma niks  :Smile:

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## CLIVE-TRIANGLE

I know of three very large companies that have a zero tolerance policy, at least with regards to their operating plant.

Security have meters and do random testing as people arrive for work. Contractors’ staff especially are targeted. Any alcohol at all and you are barred from entrance.

I don’t know how this affects their own staff, but in the case of contractors it something like baseball; three strikes in three months and you are out! Not the person – the company!

This has been in place for quite some time and everybody lives with it. I have on a few occasions entertained the CEOs of contractors who watch the clock and at 21:00 they have their last drink. Usually they leave around midnight but not before they test themselves to check that they may drive, at least. Before they go to site the next day, they test themselves and if they show any alcohol whatsoever, they wait an hour and test again.

These guys all have different rules for their staff, but in all cases they “pull” the a guy from the team if he has been barred once and he is re-deployed, figuring that it is bound to happen again...

The whole issue is included in their employment contracts and naturally if a guy has been barred from a site, he has unwittingly incapacitated himself.

Personally, I have been known to consume vast quantities of wine most nights, so it would be a real problem for me. On the upside, if I have even a single drink when we go out, I don’t drive. Never ever. Fortunately my wife drives and never touches alcohol.

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tec0 (27-Sep-13)

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## tec0

> I know of three very large companies that have a zero tolerance policy, at least with regards to their operating plant.
> 
> Security have meters and do random testing as people arrive for work. Contractors staff especially are targeted. Any alcohol at all and you are barred from entrance.
> 
> I dont know how this affects their own staff, but in the case of contractors it something like baseball; three strikes in three months and you are out! Not the person  the company!
> 
> This has been in place for quite some time and everybody lives with it. I have on a few occasions entertained the CEOs of contractors who watch the clock and at 21:00 they have their last drink. Usually they leave around midnight but not before they test themselves to check that they may drive, at least. Before they go to site the next day, they test themselves and if they show any alcohol whatsoever, they wait an hour and test again.
> 
> These guys all have different rules for their staff, but in all cases they pull the a guy from the team if he has been barred once and he is re-deployed, figuring that it is bound to happen again...
> ...


It is a far cry from the old days if you think about it. Remember the time where strip-clubs was basically mandatory in any negotiation alongside vast quantities of alcohol and strippers.  Then there was always the question about bribing. 

I have to say the mining industry cleaned house for the most part. Those corrupted people are all gone now. Now if you want to talk business it will happen in the office. .. Bribing is a thing of the past! The rules are stricter but well worth it as you get paid on time.

So yes I am all for the more Formal negotiation system as you dont have to make promises that will sink your company you dont have to give up your family life to be a business man. I am very thankful for the way businesses are run today. 

I like it when it is good and fair and clean. Yes you dont always get the contract but if the contractor that got it screwed up they actually phone you ask you to come in talk about how to fix and give you your chance! 

It is awesome!  And much thanks to whomever cleaned house! You did a stunning job!     :Thumbup:

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## tec0

I see you get places that can put your company logo on the breathalyzers. Cost is well within reason and the device is actually smaller then I would imagine. Very nice...

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## adrianh

So here is an idea, why don't you give away breathalyzers, condoms, clean needles, baby powder, bum cream and toilet paper to all your staff. Each one will get a monthly "mommy looks after her little baby package"

I mean, its not as if you employ adults who are able to think for themselves, who take responsibility for their own wellbeing, let alone the wellbeing of their co-workers and the public at large.

eish dude...putting a band aid on a symptom adds no value, to the contrary, it allows the disease to spread. Drinking too much is a symptom of a larger deeper problem, treat the core of the problem rather than a possible outcome.

It is like saying people could drive at 200kmh in town so we must give those people their own personal alarm so that they can be warned when the go over 60kmh....don't you think that it is absurd to give a person a gadget so that he is able to do what he is supposed to, which incidentally, responsible people are already capable of doing themselves.

You must spend a bit of time and look this term up on Google "Locus of control" this term explains our different views on who is responsible for our wellbeing.

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## wynn

I always say no to alcohol,
It just doesn't listen.

Dilbert

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## tec0

> So here is an idea, why don't you give away breathalyzers, condoms, clean needles, baby powder, bum cream and toilet paper to all your staff. Each one will get a monthly "mommy looks after her little baby package"
> 
> I mean, its not as if you employ adults who are able to think for themselves, who take responsibility for their own wellbeing, let alone the wellbeing of their co-workers and the public at large.
> 
> eish dude...putting a band aid on a symptom adds no value, to the contrary, it allows the disease to spread. Drinking too much is a symptom of a larger deeper problem, treat the core of the problem rather than a possible outcome.
> 
> It is like saying people could drive at 200kmh in town so we must give those people their own personal alarm so that they can be warned when the go over 60kmh....don't you think that it is absurd to give a person a gadget so that he is able to do what he is supposed to, which incidentally, responsible people are already capable of doing themselves.
> 
> You must spend a bit of time and look this term up on Google "Locus of control" this term explains our different views on who is responsible for our wellbeing.


Despite popular believe I am not stupid. 

The problem with alcohol starts in areas where there is no control over who can buy alcohol. They are unlicensed and very profitable so there is no real short term effective solution.  Limiting the amount of alcohol that a single person can buy would be a start but I question the effectiveness. 

Realistically the police cant be everywhere and yes you get people that tip the police but it takes a few weeks and you will have new people replacing them because it is profitable.  I really dont like the idea but some say the only way to stop alcohol abuse is to stop it at its source but history showed that this is also a bad move. 

Prohibition (law) a law forbidding the sale of alcoholic beverages in the 1920s was ineffective also job scarcity as it is it would be a massive blow to our economy. Education fails because people want to get drunk they want to forget and become irresponsible. For them drinking is an escape. 

So really is there a realistic effective solution to this problem? No there is not... Now does that mean you have to give-up? 

You are right it might be a band aid.

You cant force people to do anything but you can remind them that we are sharing the space. We dont need a drunk dude on the road. An active approach may well be our only real solution and even that will take time.

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## adrianh

Dude, there is simply one thing that this country needs and that is discipline, it should be this simple, you get caught and you get your nuts ripped off. I bet that only 3 people will get caught and the $h1t will stop.

You need to learn that the best therapy for people who are to stupid to think for themselves is slap therapy.

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## HR Solutions

Yes agree with you Adrian.  And we are doing things about it.  Overseas they have cabs and public transport and they know this is available.  Here in SA it has started big time a few years ago.  Its up to us now to realize this way of thinking and have their no on speed dial to call them.  It is happening.  I see it in my kids as well.  They are very good at picking the driver of the night who is not going to drink or having the cab company's no on their cell phones to phone if they are over the limit.  And they, like all of us know when you are over the limit without a gizmo.  Cabs are also quite reasonably priced as well.  I know when I'm in CT, it is even more prominent there.  You see cabs running all over and the public transport is excellent.  I see busses running up and down Seapoint to the V&A and CBD right thro the night. And as Adrian says, sort out the problem right at the beginning.  Arrest them if they are over the limit, which they are doing right now.

Just another quick one.  A friend of mynes son was arrested about a year ago for over the limit.  The cops bashed him around a bit, kept him over night, gave him a helluva talking to and let him go the following day.  This has left quite an impact on him and he has never driven over the limit again.  Now I know that some of you are going to have a whole lot to say about this, which I do understand, but it worked for him.  He says he does not want to go thro that again !!
I'm not sure what I would do if this was my son, considering this boy was WAY over the limit driving !!!

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## tec0

> Dude, there is simply one thing that this country needs and that is discipline, it should be this simple, you get caught and you get your nuts ripped off. I bet that only 3 people will get caught and the $h1t will stop.
> 
> You need to learn that the best therapy for people who are to stupid to think for themselves is slap therapy.


It must be a choice... If it isn’t an active choice that someone made to better themselves than the system has no value. The promise of pain will work only for so long then people will find ways around it, or plan to combat it. History is full of people trying to force other people and normally they don’t last.

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## pmbguy

> If SA Breweries are clever they can still sponsor sports even on school level. All they have to do is take the beer out of the water and just sell the water with added goodness... It is not an energy drink just a good clean healthy drink that every child in South Africa can enjoy. 
> 
> ...


Possible, however it will be tricky PR and Marketing for them to diversify all the way to kids products, but almost anything is possible. I can definitely see them doing something like non-alcoholic drinks or energy drinks etc to supplement the slight decrease in consumption of alcoholic drinks in the years to come after the banning. In that event SAB will make moves probably into new markets and new products a bit at a time. How strongly SAB react will give us an indication as to how successful the banning is. That all being said SAB is strong, they have a huge beer drinking market, they may just cut some fat and do business almost as usual. Just out of my head I would say a 5% new-drinker reduction due to the banning over 15years is probably an optimistic figure (if thats even possible to calculate, way too many variables). 



I just saw the ad in my head 

lalalala....how there little kids my name is Bobby Brew......lalalala......hey have you guys tried our new Dampie lollies....its a blast! Hey Moms we promise it wont do what our other products do to some families lalalala... What a croc of shit, made me spill my Black label

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## pmbguy

> Yes, I also think that they shouldn't show images of women because that leads to dancing which leads to lust which leads to sex which leads to STDs and HIV. But thinking about it, they shouldn't show men either because that leads to gay-ness which of course leads to floral shirts which leads to pantyhose which leads to men carrying handbags and driving little pink Mini's.


Dam dude I almost had a stroke after reading this  :Online2long:  Just to clarify does this ban extent to private dvd's? Shit I hope not! I have some bay watch on tape back here somewhere :EEK!:

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## adrianh

No, it doesn't extend to private collections of "art" because those collections are already well hidden from the DM... although I must admit my DM has inadvertently come across my collection and the agreement we came to was that that if she even f...ks with my pc again then there will be groot k@k

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## tec0

Truth is beer is about as old as civilization itself and civilization my well owe its existence to beer. It is a well known fact that back in the day beer was used to trade with and yes back in those days your kids drank beer all day long. Truth is it was healthy stuff. 

The beer that they had back then had low quantities of antibiotics so it kept them healthy. Don’t believe me? Watch it for yourself then.  




So let me be clear I have nothing against having a beer it is the drunk drivers that gets my tits in a twist.  :Mad:

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IanF (28-Sep-13)

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## pmbguy

Hey Tec did you hear that? it’s all going to be OK. Your collection of midget movies are save, don’t stress

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## pmbguy

Ag sorry Tec I was just joking about the Midgets. I am very serious about my own collection though. My DM does not approve, but she knows not to mess with my shit.

I drank lots of beer as a bachelor, but since I met my DM not so much. I don’t drink in the week at all but on weekends I have a beer, ice cold black label. I never drink and drive I sit next to her making remarks on her driving. 

YEARS ago before I met my wife I was driving alone across to a another farm where I was at a party farm-pub-party and the cops had a roadblock out, it was at about 5am or so when I came driving along in my 900cc Zuzuki mini loaf bus, it’s basically a mini mini bus 6seater but I have fit 10 people in before. Anyway so I looked at the cops as if I was lank fresh waking up, on the way to the dam, I had the rods sticking out and everything. The one cop signalled me to stop I gave an enthusiastic posture pop and greeted the man waving in good morning cheer.....zoop I go past, I did not see their reaction but they did not come after me...I was off in the night....I was very lucky that time, but trust me on this, no braai or party is that that good, no amazing beer that great to risk being somebody’s bitch in the holding cell.

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## tec0

> Ag sorry Tec I was just joking about the Midgets. I am very serious about my own collection though. My DM does not approve, but she knows not to mess with my shit.
> 
> I drank lots of beer as a bachelor, but since I met my DM not so much. I dont drink in the week at all but on weekends I have a beer, ice cold black label. I never drink and drive I sit next to her making remarks on her driving. 
> 
> YEARS ago before I met my wife I was driving alone across to a another farm where I was at a party farm-pub-party and the cops had a roadblock out, it was at about 5am or so when I came driving along in my 900cc Zuzuki mini loaf bus, its basically a mini mini bus 6seater but I have fit 10 people in before. Anyway so I looked at the cops as if I was lank fresh waking up, on the way to the dam, I had the rods sticking out and everything. The one cop signalled me to stop I gave an enthusiastic posture pop and greeted the man waving in good morning cheer.....zoop I go past, I did not see their reaction but they did not come after me...I was off in the night....I was very lucky that time, but trust me on this, no braai or party is that that good, no amazing beer that great to risk being somebodys bitch in the holding cell.


A long time ago, very long actually people I knew crashed while out on a pub-crawl. All 4 of them dead in a single night. Not one of them saw 21. Not a long time after I lost a family member to alcohol "died in his bed" didn't see 50. I have been around the block many times... and really I can go on and on and maybe I will? I don't know yet... 

But what I do know is you owe me everything hehehehe  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): 

I will come for yous soul soon enough  :Cool:  just need your address  :Wink:

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## pmbguy

@tec0 - I never said what was in the papsak...mmmm         :Bananadance:

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## tec0

> @tec0 - I never said what was in the papsak...mmmm


ah but little did you know I drink only 3 things dude water, coffee and coca-cola not one comes in a papsak  :Cool: 

But don't you worry I don't want anything so your collection of "art" and everything else for that matter is safe from me. 

We will talk business when the time comes  :Wink:  

Fear not  :Stick Out Tongue:

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## pmbguy

Hey Tec I hope your tummy is not to sore from all the cola and niknacks last night, if it is a bit sore drink some bong water it works wonders

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## IanF

> Truth is beer is about as old as civilization itself and civilization my well owe its existence to beer. It is a well known fact that back in the day beer was used to trade with and yes back in those days your kids drank beer all day long. Truth is it was healthy stuff. 
> 
> The beer that they had back then had low quantities of antibiotics so it kept them healthy. Don’t believe me? Watch it for yourself then.  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So let me be clear I have nothing against having a beer it is the drunk drivers that gets my tits in a twist.


Teco
That is one of the best (M)documentaries I have seen thanks for sharing. If anyone else watches it is 42 minutes long but very entertaining

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tec0 (28-Sep-13)

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## adrianh

So, a certain young gentleman goes to the doctor, 
he says "Dr my chopper is bright orange"
so the doctor asks him about his life, what work he does, how he feels, whether he gets enough exercise etc.
everything seems in order so the doctor ask whether he is married, he says no,
next the doctor asks whether he has a girlfriend and he says no,
so the doctor thinks for a bit and asks him what he does in the evening to pass the time,
He answers "I watch porn and eat Nik NaKs"....

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wynn (30-Sep-13)

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## HR Solutions

Lol ........

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## tec0

> Hey Tec I hope your tummy is not to sore from all the cola and niknacks last night, if it is a bit sore drink some bong water it works wonders


I am guilty on the cola part... as for niknacks? Nah... Big corn bites on the other hand...  :Yes:  Wish I had some last night...

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## tec0

> Teco
> That is one of the best (M)documentaries I have seen thanks for sharing. If anyone else watches it is 42 minutes long but very entertaining


I am actually looking for the DVD  :Stick Out Tongue:  

Got a lot of cool facts  :Yes:

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## pmbguy

Now that’s how I look after I indulged too much in my hot source I make. I believe one symptom is called spuit poeping.

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