# General Business Category > Business Finance Forum >  Lovely news years day present from Pick n Pay

## nkawit

Title: Murphy (PNP?) Strikes again to ruin my new year

I pay my utilities bills, municipality and some Telkom accounts at PNP right.

So on the 30th November I went and paid about R60k of accounts. They always have to phone for authorization because FNB has some limits they've placed on transaction sizes. So I wait 2 hours for them to find the right number and 30 minutes for them to get my bank on the other side. They get the auth code, go back to the till and there is some kind of an error. I take down all their details, they take down mine. Half way out the store, they call me back and give me the receipt saying the transaction was processed.

About 1 week later the amount was reversed off my card, so I immediately called them and went in for them to fix it. Their takings department in Kenilworth confirmed the amount was returned as they did not take an imprint of my card. So they proceed to take the amount manually. This time their bank says my bank declined the transaction. I promptly get my bank on the phone, and give it to them despite the audience I now have outside the office at PNP. FNB auth talks to the sales person, gets ABSA on the line and sorts it out. R60k goes off.

About 1 week after that, I saw the amount dissapear again, I went into the store again, spoke to the branch manager and asked to confirm all was ok. They called PNP HQ and confirmed all was ok.

On the 1st of Jan 2012, off goes another R60k. Nailing my CC R40k into the red at 7am in the morning with a lovely R210 overlimit fee. FNB calls, demanding immediate payment or I face suspension. I told them this transaction was NOT authorized by me and they refuse to reverse it. I try call PNP, no answer. Tried their HQ, no answer. Get every cent I own and pay it into my CC. Clearing it to just over R1 available.

Yesterday (Jan 2nd), I go into PNP and ask to speak to the manager. He is very apologetic, says he will have it sorted out but everyone is on holiday. Today I get a call from their HQ and they say they will reverse the amount and look into the R210 I was charged by the bank. Heard nothing back so far on that.

Thing is, it will take around 5-7 days for them to reverse the amount. Meanwhile my credit card is now in "BAD STANDING", all my ebucks benefits have been SUSPENDED till the 3rd of March 2012 and I literally do not have a cent to my name for groceries or anything.

I live off my credit card (in a good way) and have enough money passing through it every month to give me around R2k-R5k worth of ebucks to spend at makro and to clear the entire outstanding amount. I finance projects for my business using my CC (easy money, 60 days no interest). I use my benefits to save money at stores and to get more ebucks at other stores. So ya.... its vital to both me and my business.

Worst thing is ... I probably have no legal avenue to have this remedied and will just have to wait until the money is reversed and pay the interest to take cash out my CC to pay back the loan I used to clear it.

Have a good laugh, and buy me a beer, kthxbi.

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## gac

This story is enough to send my Irish genes into an unbridled frenzy!!!
Another example which brings me to ask myself whether we are actually moving forward or backwards in this technological world. Granted it may be a person error but still doesnt belie the fact that we are perhaps too clever for our own good.

I think I would be inclined to approach somebody senior within PnP and demand, not ask, they make a plan to re-instate you back into the position you should have been in with no questions asked. They created the situation, so they must fix it. No bullshit just do it!

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## Dave A

One of the problems with the modern systems approach to everything - when it derails it derails *properly!*

*And* is a bastard to fix... I suspect because no-one on the front lines of customer service is allowed to use common sense or good judgement anymore.

A classic example of systemic systems failure.

I hope it is cleared up soon, and you are adequately compensated for the SNAFU.

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Citizen X (06-Jan-12)

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## tec0

I tend not to do business this way An example would be if I need to pay Telkom I go to Telkom's office in a week day and pay them.  For the most part I opened a second account and put money in it from my main account via debit order.

So on each month there is enough funds available to pay ALL my bills. Using internet banking I normally pay them all in less than an hour. I get an active record and because my main account is safe and isolated from the net and so I have added security. 

If you are going to go and spend 60k at PNP you are asking for trouble I took the time and got all the bank info from each or the places I do business with. Then I pay them with the reference info they provided. 

To date it never failed once 

I had the problem once where a business stated that I haven't paid. I printed out the statement at my bank had the bank manager stamp it. They didn't accept it and I was forced to go my lawyer. A court date was set and before the date the business found there mistake and rectified it promptly. 

This shows one that mistakes WILL happen but if you have the RIGHT records and evidence and a legal aid "that one can pay monthly" Your business will be well protected "or at least you can do something if something goes wrong"

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## Blurock

I agree with techO. You do not order sushi at a hamburger joint or steak from a fishmonger. Why even bother to go to PnP to do banking business?

 It may be OK for personal business, but business transactions require real banking if you want a measure of safety and recourse. With internet banking you can transact from any where and you are in charge. :Cool:

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## nkawit

For R2k-5k worth of ebucks ... I'll use CC thanks

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## Justloadit

You can still use your credit card as a paying mechanism using an EFT, and still earn the EBUCKS with FNB internet banking. Simply link your card to your internet profile.

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## Blurock

Good advice. You do not need a cheque account to do internet banking. Use your credit card account or link it to a savings account with a debit card.  :Wink:

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## nkawit

You do not earn ebucks when you do EFT's from a Credit Card. You only earn on purchases. Paying you bills counts as a purchase. Plus you pay interest from day one with cash withdrawls and EFT payments. I am no expert, I can only explain what the terms are on my portfolio and what is stated on my statement.

As far as I can tell there do exist special ebucks offers they make to certain clients. My wife does not have the same earn profile as me, nor does a colleague of mine with the same type of card. I do receive periodic profile update notices and each time I earn more and more. R2k-R5k may not seem like alot every month, but add it up over a year.... no ways I'm passing that up.

I normally pay all my accounts online using EasyPay, until they updated their site and broke my transactions, since then they have fixed it (thanks Thabo)  and I am doing the transactions myself. I have no problem doing EFT's if I need to, but if I can earn money using my CC .... be very sure I will take every opportunity I get to do so.

All in all, how one pays their accounts is irrelevant (whether you buy electricity online, pay your municipal account by EFT, or your phone accounts at PNP or whatever).... my point is a bank does not care how you ended in up in the situation you are, nor does Transunion ITC, no matter how much explaining one does you're still just as screwed even if everything was caused by a simple mistake.

Any case, I got 4 calls today from them and it appears they making every effort to resolve the issue with the bank and restore my credit profile to its previous state.

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## Justloadit

Aha, was under the impression you did. So EBUCKS are only earned when you physically use your credit card, which means that the merchant is supporting EBUCKS from the commission charged on the CC transaction.

You can also get fuel rewards if you use the fuel card to purchase fuel, however be wary here, as they charge your card R7.50 per transaction and if I am not mistaken, they charge you interest from the day you fill up to the day you pay, because it is a fuel transaction. Can not check it now as I am nowhere near a statement to verify the exact costings.

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## nkawit

> Aha, was under the impression you did. So EBUCKS are only earned when you physically use your credit card, which means that the merchant is supporting EBUCKS from the commission charged on the CC transaction..


Bingo!

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## Blurock

I earn E-bucks on my FNB business account. I only do EFT's and no cheque or card transactions. E-bucks does not pay very well so it is not a motivator for my transactions. It is just a small freebie from the bank. It is only slightly better than PnP's store card where you earn R1 for every R1000 spent.  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## nkawit

1-3% of purchases are offered by *some* places ...

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## AndyD

> It is only slightly better than PnP's store card where you earn R1 for every R1000 spent.


PnP's smarty shopper card gives you 1% back on your spend (R1 for every R100 spent).



> For every whole South African Rand spent on point-eligible items, a smart point will be earned





> 1000 smart points are equal to R10 cash back on your card against a future purchase


Source

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Blurock (06-Jan-12)

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## nkawit

There is also that eat healthy thing where you get 25% back??!?!  something crazy like that which my wife asked me to sign up for

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## tec0

I got one of those PNP cards and deemed it pointless. With the small amount they give back I can maybe purchase a packet of smarties...  :Stick Out Tongue: 

Now this just sucks!!! 




> The only transactions for which you do not earn smart points are coffee shops, fuel, tobacco and tobacco related products,


Especially if I consider how much gets spend on cigarettes  :Rant1:  

Pure discrimination !!!

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## thinusmj

How to earn eBucks

*Based on your banking behaviour, you can now earn up to 2.5% back in eBucks on all your qualifying FNB Cheque Card purchases*

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## Blurock

> There is also that eat healthy thing where you get 25% back??!?!  something crazy like that which my wife asked me to sign up for


This really works, but do not buy coke and chips with your healthy food as that will penalise you and you will lose points and discounts. Discovery is doing this to encourage people to live healthy. By changing to a healthy lifestyle, one supposedly do not get sick so often and thus less medical aid claims. So they (and their sponsoring partners) can afford to give you incentives such as discounts on airline tickets, hotels etc. :Big Grin:

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## gac

What is the outcome of this saga?

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## nkawit

Money + bank fine refunded.

Credit rating at bank still not fixed.

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## gac

Glad to hear it (so far) & hope you resolve the remainder. Big Up on making a stand

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