# Social Category > South African Politics Forum >  Racism is racism is racism ...

## ChrisNG53

Please decide which of the following statements are true as regards South Africa: -

a)   human beings are categorized according to ethnicity under AA laws and BEE protocols;
b)   with Whites excluded from jobs and contracts as a matter of course;
c)  with Blacks included as of right;
d) and with Coloureds/Indians/Chinese to be included only if they first claim and prove that they are Black;
e) the effect of this is that rights and privileges are being accorded on the basis of race, ethnicity and colour;
f) this was the paradigm approach of the apartheid culture and system;
g) this culture is racist;
h) racism is evil;
i) and racism begets more evil.

Never mind which you may want to bake it, all of the above statements are true. We have racism. We have adopted it, believe in it, nurture it,  sustain it, and propagate it  despite its evil nature.

I wish I am wrong. I will be greatly  relieved if someone can prove me wrong. I dont think I am. Discussions I have had with very good people, and some brilliant minds, have faltered right here  when the above statements have to be admitted one by one.
The answer often proffered, and it is the only possible answer, is that by some tortuous process of intellectualized alchemy, it is all OK because it is packaged as AA and BEE. When I point out that you cant play the Black card to resolve a complaint about obsession with Blackness   silence  and lots of well you see  and then lots of gobledigook, spin and emotive ramblings.

I have also heard some pretty important people, including a high profile judge, say it is justified in the cause of transformation. This is no different to saying the end justifies the means. So should you should pin me to a medal if I expose a plot to bomb Soccer City and kill 80, 000 people    sure. 
Do you still award me the medal if I obtained the info by torturing the informants? 

The justification argument simply doesnt wash, both philosophically and in jurisprudence. The means always needs to be as inviolate as the objective.

Now if I am right  and pray God I am not, the implications are quite horrendous. These include the fact that the whole nation is delusional for imagining that something that is plainly evil is good. It also includes the fact that a whole bunch of important people and institutions, such as the Human Rights Commission, are conniving and colluding at systemic evil. 

And just to put the justification argument to bed. It is simple enough to devise a criteria under which AA is applied on the basis of subsisting apartheid induced disadvantage. Since Blacks are the majority in this category they would still be the primary beneficiaries. However the model would not be racist. 

Now will someone explain, in language that has the simplicity of truth, that what is set out above is false.

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## Justloadit

To me any form of favoritism that includes race or colour as a directive is racist.

When will BEE be thrown out as it is pure racism - which in fact is even against the ANC preachings.

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## desA

It gets interesting when I tell locals that they can stick their BEE claptrap. Fact is, they can also stick the rest as well.

SA is now worse in the racism stakes than it was under apartheid. Only difficulty is that 'they' will battle to launch the country into the high-tech arena with almost no decent local high-tech talent left in the country. This is the fruit of 'their' racist policy. 

'They' will only realise the severity of things, when their new taskmasters - the Chinese - really take control of the economy. Little that 'they' can do after that.   :Smile:

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## Dave A

> It is simple enough to devise a criteria under which AA is applied on the basis of subsisting apartheid induced disadvantage. Since Blacks are the majority in this category they would still be the primary beneficiaries. However the model would not be racist.


That's the really sad part - it would work as well if not better, at least when it comes to *BB*BEE. 

*But* (and it's a big but) - Where this particular "non-racial" qualification concept falls flat on its face is when it comes to getting into the "big money" league. Normally that takes track record and/or having the capital to play with.

Of late I've wondered whether we got this racially aligned policy that has done little to aid _broad based_ transformation from narrow mindedness, or whether it was deliberate - ie. *broad based* transformation wasn't the primary objective.

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## tec0

To my limited and somewhat uneducated mind, I would imagine that AA and BBBEE are preferred and not a law I stand to be corrected. However large organisations enforce it as a law with no exceptions. So I dont think it is about race at all. It is about attitude. 

Have a look at our constitution, if any company discriminate against you on Race, Religion or Gender then you have the right to bring this matter to court. I personally cannot understand why political parties are so hesitant. Write to the political party that you support give them the documentation that you have and allow them to contact the UN and ask for an international court hearing. 

It is simple if the constitution gives acceptation and you as a citizen are not an equal anymore, then the UN must react for its existence it to keep peace and create and sustain equality.

International law  :Confused: 
United Nations  :Cool: 
United Nations South Africa  :Big Grin:

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Butch Hannan (02-Jan-11)

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## Butch Hannan

There is one thing that we all seem to forget and that is the word "tribalism" A great majority of our population fall under this simple word. A very well educated black engineer friend of mine said to me and to quote him "Butch you had better believe that tribalism is very alive and well in South Africa". This can be seen in some of the appointments made by President Zuma. Is Beke Cele really the best man for the job.
I believe that South African society has to a large degree been conditioned to the fact that only white people can be racists. :Mad: 
The black people suffer from an inferiority complex caused by wallowing in a quagmire of self pity. Until they get over this state of "entitlement" I cannot ever see things improving. By and large they still do not see themselves as equals in spite of the constitution which tells them that they are.

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## tec0

* 9.Equality
*
1. Everyone is equal before the law and has the right to equal protection and benefit of the law.

2. Equality includes the full and equal enjoyment of all rights and freedoms. To promote the achievement of equality, legislative and other measures designed to protect or advance persons, or categories of persons, disadvantaged by unfair discrimination may be taken.

3. The state may not unfairly discriminate directly or indirectly against anyone on one or more grounds, including race, gender, sex, pregnancy, marital status, ethnic or social origin, colour, sexual orientation, age, disability, religion, conscience, belief, culture, language and birth.

4. No person may unfairly discriminate directly or indirectly against anyone on one or more grounds in terms of subsection (3). National legislation must be enacted to prevent or prohibit unfair discrimination.

5. Discrimination on one or more of the grounds listed in subsection (3) is unfair unless it is established that the discrimination is fair.

Please note number five {5} Discrimination on one or more of the grounds listed in subsection (3) is unfair unless it is established that the discrimination is fair. Now who do you think is on the receiving end of this? 

* 
Meaning of Discrimination as defined by Dictionary:
*
noun

1. an act or instance of discriminating.

2. treatment or consideration of, or making a distinction in favor of or against, a person or thing based on the group, class, or category to which that person or thing belongs rather than on individual merit: racial and religious intolerance and discrimination.

3. the power of making fine distinctions; discriminating judgment: She chose the colors with great discrimination.

4. Archaic . something that serves to differentiate.

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## Chrisjan B

Please note number five {5} “Discrimination on one or more of the  grounds listed in subsection (3) is unfair unless it is established that  the discrimination is fair.” Now who do you think is on the receiving  end of this?

Not me.....

And I am disadvantaged... as I am disabled - hard of hearing, but my wife say only if it suits me!
I don't want anything from these people anyway...

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## tec0

Agreed, it is true that there are many unfair systems “that are deemed fair because the powers that be so wills it. I say go on, live work “if you can find it” and do whatever is possible within the limitations.

Eventually there will be a realisation and with it change.

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## Justloadit

> 5. Discrimination on one or more of the grounds listed in subsection (3) is unfair unless it is established that the discrimination is fair.


That is where the loop hole is. Who decides when it is fair or not?

So one will never win a legal case. A very carefully worded clause which makes AA and BBBEE legal.

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## tec0

Well, you can challenge this problem legally as it is your right to do so. I would recommend that you do research on the subject before saying or claiming anything. A good place to start is here; The Universal Declaration of Human Rights as stated by the UN

The Universal Declaration of Human Rights Article 7;

All are equal before the law and are entitled *without any discrimination* to equal protection of the law. All are entitled to equal protection against any discrimination in violation of this Declaration and against any incitement to such discrimination.

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## ChrisNG53

I have little doubt that if the whole AA and BEE models were challenged they would be either struck down or receive a sever mauling by the Constitutional Court.
Whatever may have been "imagined" when the model were configured, actual experience has proved beyond any doubt that *they are racist.*
Beverley Tatham, a renowned Black expert on the subject, states that "_if you want to establish racism just see who is benefiting ... and who is not ."_
On this test we find that Blacks benefit *whether or not they are actually disadvantaged*. 
This occurs under AA and BEE.
Under BEE the benefits are just "fabulous".
By no stretch of the imagination, or anything else, can this be classified as "fair" discrimination. It is a no brainer.
*If it is not fair it is unconstitutional.*
It would be also quite easy to augment the challenge by mapping out the other insidious effects we now have = _"all are equal but Blacks are more equal"_
For instance - what do Sonia and Mathew Booth tell their children about what and who they are? If they stick with *truth* their children are automatically excluded from jobs and contracts ...i.e, are second class citizens.
A system that coerces children to deny or under value their own father's ethnicity is quite obviously inherently evil ... and therefore unconstitutional.

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## tec0

I really dont get it; do you honestly think ALL people think that way?  :Mad: 

I dont, I would simply say you are not getting the full picture. At this moment labour brokers are controlling ALL work in my aria, they dont care about colour, and they dont care about labour laws and unions and equality.

 All they want is cheap labour so that they can take there half of all the people that works money, and I really cannot justify why we have labour brokers because they are singlehandedly destroying any and every job culture that we worked to get.

Laws both National and International exist so that you can be protected. But I dont see people using those laws. No I see a lot of posts all over the internet of angry people screaming about this and that. Hoping that others will stand up and do the deed.

It is called laziness! You are interested in getting people angry, hoping that they will cause change. 

Change start by writing a letter to your political party. To do things legally and correctly!!! Then your political party is responsible to create awareness and they must bring it to the attention of all the other parties involved and the UN. Only then can the UN call for a formal hearing and investigation and only then can problems be solved.     

But it is so much work contacting your friends and family by e-mail asking them to start writing letters to our political parties via e-mail. It is so much work to call your political party and ask who is responsible for what and how the systems work. It is so horribly difficult for you to do anything and there is no shortage of excuses. 

See you must take the first step, yes it will take time, and yes there will be difficulties. But again, why must you do anything at all?

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## Dave A

> But I don’t see people using those laws. No I see a lot of posts all over the internet of angry people screaming about this and that. Hoping that others will stand up and do the deed.


Are you surprised people don't trust the legal system to do the job anymore? And at a reasonable price? Zuma, Shaik, a slew of very expensive drunk driving defences paid for by rates and taxes despite the fact that they were lost causes pretty much from the outset. Fighting for justice through the legal system has become affordable only to multi-millionaires and people with access to public money.



> But it is so much work contacting your friends and family by e-mail asking them to start writing letters...


Those angry people *are* giving voice to their frustration. If they can't afford the legal costs of pursuing justice, at least they're raising public awareness of the issues they face.



> ...to our political parties via e-mail. It is so much work to call your political party and ask who is responsible for what and how the systems work.


They're politicians - do you expect an honest answer? At best they'll tell you what you want to hear and remind you to vote for them at the next election.

If they were honest, and depending on which political party you're calling, the truthful answers would be either "I'm responsible - don't you dare stuff up my gravy train ride" or "I don't have the power to change a single damn thing just at the moment."

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## tec0

Yes our law system is... I rather not finish this sentence But international laws is something else or so we hope. See in the end it is about getting a voice, if enough people use the proper but difficult system Then we might get lucky and the UN will take an active interest. 

But if people just continue to criticise and only point to their frustrations then basically we are deflecting interest and things will not change. We must point out the facts and only the facts. Nobody listens to an angry mob they just shoot teargas at the mob and write them off as extremist.

But if you push your concerns forward using the proper systems and factual concerns then the chances improve somewhat.  :Smile:

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## ChrisNG53

Teco - I hear you loud and clear. It is all very frustrating as with so many other aspects of our country.
And yes ... just moaning and groaning about it achieves nothing.
In my case I have blogged the thing and sent an appeal to all the main "opinion makers". Social networking can be a very powerful medium.
I have also devoted space in a book I have written.
It's all I can do ... mini crusade within the limits of my resources. Propagating TRUTH has never caused harm and often induces change.
What I don't believe in is to grumble, moan and groan ... without confronting centers of power and influence.
What I have noticed is that these centers of power and influence "don't want to know" ... "don't give a sh%#" -- and that is why nothing changes. The Editor of the Sowetan deleted my appeal without even reading it.
But does that mean one should then just "shut up". No!, because those who benefit from maintaining the _status quo_ want you to do just that ... shut up and lump it.
The present situation is SA is obscene ... it is evil ... and I, for one, will not shut up about it.

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## desA

I've only been back in SA since mid July. 

A few things I've come across thus far (not an exhaustive list, by any means):
1.  To obtain government (largish) contracts, BEE status is mandatory;
2.  Corruption at the highest levels is rife - actually all the way down the grab chain;
3.  ANC youth league promotes Zuma's son's business interests - blatantly;
4.  People's lives are threatened if they expose this rampant corruption;
5.  A lecturer at a University needs to be dark green to obtain a permanent position (blatant); 
6.  Current 'top' (light green) lecturers at many universities are on one year contracts - already some have retired 2-3 times;
7.  Light green businesses struggle to get registered (excessive times). Dark green seem to breeze through;
8.  The road systems are collapsing;
9.  Young light green school leavers face a jobless future;
10.  Too many 'workers' demand their 'rights', & prefer to strike & not work;
11.  SA salaries are in excess of 2-3x those of SE Asia - productivity 1/2, or less of SE Asia;
12.  Cartels rule the roost in SA;
13.  SA is moving down the skids - slowly, but surely;
14.  The chances of a regime-change coup grow daily - together with the growing season of discontent.
15.  SA's medical industry has slipped far behind health-care in SE Asia.
16.  Doctors & pharmacies are milking the local previously-advantaged population - in extreme measure.
17.  SA's housing bubble is the highest in the world. It is about to burst.
18.  Food is excessively expensive.
19.  SA is now importing food. (Where have the farmers gone?)
20.  SA farm murders are rife.
21.  Farm expropriation pressures loom. (Welcome to SAmbabwe).
22.  The rugby coach is appointed based on colour, not ability.
23.  At SA Home Affairs, what used to take 2 days to sort out, is still not settled 5 months later - with no end in sight. (Zuma praises Home Affairs).

One only has to wonder what SA could have looked like were a non-racist policy to have been followed.

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## ChrisNG53

*DesaA* - your summary is so indicative of an overall situation that is "surreal", i.e, real but hardly recognized as such.
In my book "The Other -without fear,favour or prejudice-" I devote a Chapter titled "And the frog is boiled alive" in which I also summarise this incredible situation where we simply accept, tolerate, acquiesce in, allow ... the most *abnormal, intolerable* situations to subsist ... without realizing that, in effect, we are being "boiled alive" ... slowly but surely.
The Zuma government has obviously sensed this phenomena and there are some clear indications that it wants to arrest the situation. However it is severely hamstrung, on any number of counts, especially as the "Black is entitled" dogma has corrupted the whole State in it's emotional intelligence. In short, no one is even starting to see the inherent evil that is now a national religion, spawning anything and everything except *"true transformation"* of our post apartheid society.
The media is quite valiant but somewhat "superficial" about the paradigm problems besetting this nation. So you have a "daft" Lead SA campaign that we must all switch on our lights *apparently to better see vehicles that we can already see quite perfectly*, thus distracting us from the *real problem which is bad road use culture.*
Another example is the "General" Beke Cele led national idea that the cure to crime is 
"more police", "harsher sentences" ... etc without doing anything about the underlying problem of a whole nation that is infused with an _anomic culture_ whether it is a dishonest domestic worker or directors "fixing" national commodity food prices.

So all we can do is raise our voices to expose these things. As Edmund Burke said - "for evil to triumph, it requires only that good men say nothing"

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## Dave A

I had to look up the definition of anomic - I share just in case anyone else also didn't know it is a real word.



> 1. Social instability caused by erosion of standards and values.
> 2. Alienation and purposelessness experienced by a person or a class as a result of a lack of standards, values, or ideals

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dcs (06-Jan-11)

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## Chrisjan B

> I had to look up the definition of anomic - I share just in case anyone else also didn't know it is a real word.


Perfect description of what is wrong with our country at the moment...

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## desA

> "And the frog is boiled alive" in which I also summarise this incredible situation where we simply accept, tolerate, acquiesce in, allow ... the most abnormal, intolerable situations to subsist ... without realizing that, in effect, we are being "boiled alive" ... slowly but surely.


An excellent reply, Chris.

SAmbabwe is most definitely in the frog-boiling business. The whole state apparatus has been so severely eroded over the last number of years that, under the present regime, the downward slide will move into a death spiral. 

The national psyche is now firmly in the hands of the 'we demands'. Difficult times seem to lie ahead.

The leadership vacuum is tangible.

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## Justloadit

A new word for me as well.

What is interesting, is if such a word exists in the English language, it may mean that what we are experiencing now has happened before, and a word created to describe this cancer

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## Dave A

I'm more interested in how Chris came across it in the first place.

It is damningly appropriate and I was suitably impressed.

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## Chrisjan B

Me too...

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## ChrisNG53

> I'm more interested in how Chris came across it in the first place.
> 
> It is damningly appropriate and I was suitably impressed.


I am a retired judge by profession. _Anomie_ is a pretty elementary concept in the study of criminology, i.e, the study of why we have crime which is a bad manifestation of deviance.

So what you can accept is that this is not "rocket science" to thousands of our lot in the legal sector. Therefore I find it absolutely astounding that government does not appear to be getting the *obvious advice* on this score.

For example - an "expert" was being interviewed on Radio 702 about "crime" in SA. The usual "more police", "harsher sentences" tripe was on the menu. I phoned in and took the stance as to why we were concerned to _"treat acne with cream etc when the real cause was a blood disorder",_ i.e, that we should be tackling our _anomic condition,_ *the fundamental driver of all our deviance and crime.*

The good man agreed with *everything* I had to say, without the slightest qualification or reserve.
So why the frigging hell do we mess about with _"superficial", "band aid"_ strategies and ignore *fundamental realities*..???.  It drives me coo-coo ...!!!!

..... like asking me to switch on my headlights so as to better see things I can already see quite perfectly ... Are we serious??? Really?

... and, of cause, we have this *unreal approach* all over the place ... don't we?

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Dave A (07-Jan-11)

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## Dave A

> The good man agreed with *everything* I had to say, without the slightest qualification or reserve.
> So why the frigging hell do we mess about with _"superficial", "band aid"_ strategies and ignore *fundamental realities*..???.


Probably because of cognitive dissonance. The subliminal process of rationalisation means the visible evidence of the problem is so far removed from the actual fracture, the victim has problems connecting actual cause with the effect.

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## ChrisNG53

> Probably because of cognitive dissonance. The subliminal process of rationalisation means the visible evidence of the problem is so far removed from the actual fracture, the victim has problems connecting actual cause with the effect.


I don't think so, with respect. I think it was simply a case of ensuring that your bread stays nicely butterred. The expert was reporting in terms of a "government sponsored" study he and others had just done. Like all "tenderperneurs', he was always going to "babble" on about no more than was absolutely necessary ... and not start dealing in "inconvenient truths".

South Africa has a fistful of incredibly talented, brilliant people ... yet we have a "deafening silence" on a whole bunch of issues.

For instance - take the World Cup. Of cause a World Cup is terribly exciting ... etc. The reality, however, was that *we simply could not afford* to indulge ourselves in this way ... but we did ... and practically no-one raised a pipsqueak in objection. Apparently the thing made us look good ... in the eyes of the world.

Well, "looking good" is a terribly fickle commodity. Ask Tiger Woods. 
*Today, in considering South Africa, the whole world is preoccupied - not with the World Cup - but with the brutal murder of Anni Dewani!*

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## Justloadit

Ohhhhh how the truth hurts. :Banghead:

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## Sparks

Ha ha welcome to the "New South Africa. It was never this bad and will never improve. Racism is and always will be alive and kicking. The majority of the racists are obviously found in the largest ethic group. They somehow think they are more equal than the rest of us, as for their inferiority complexes, I am sure you would also have one if you could not think further than your nose. Even if it is flat.

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## Dave A

Sparks, you do realise that last post makes you a racist, I'm sure.

So if you're OK with being a racist and grant yourself the right to run down blacks on the basis of their flat noses, does that mean you don't have a problem with blacks giving themselves preferential status in some areas, such as economic entitlement or job reservation for example, ahead of you as a whitey too?

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## desA

When South Africans of alternative shades of green begin to see the situation for what it really is, & let go of their 'guilt complexes', then perhaps, just perhaps, they will begin pushing back against the racism that is destroying the country.

Come on people, open your eyes. You have to do something concrete, if you are to remain in SA. The water temperature around you is slowly rising. When will you die?

Green-tinged frogs...

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## adrianh

Who cares, forget about the rats, let them roam the streets devouring everything in their path, you ain't the Pied Piper!

The light green tinged frog will only boil if it lets itself boil - we live with our eyes wide shut. Looking, not believing what we see, yet hoping for a better day - so are the Palistinians, see where it gets them!

Bausch and Lomb once said "We can't change the way the world looks, but we can change the way you see it" We stare blindly through our lenses of hope - like fools blinded by the bull fed to us by those who speak elequently about the redistribution of land....

The ZAR picture is fading, like a painting left out in the sun.... 

Lose your conscience, make your money, and hit the road!

Say out loud;  I don't give a sh_t!

The scorpion will sting the frog because it is in the nature of the scorpion - don't hate the scorpion - it is what it is!

...and for you who don't understand what I just wrote, forget about it, DesA sure will!

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desA (11-Jan-11)

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## desA

> The ZAR picture is fading, like a painting left out in the sun....





> The scorpion will sting the frog because it is in the nature of the scorpion - don't hate the scorpion - it is what it is!


Yes, indeed.

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## ChrisNG53

> Who cares, forget about the rats, let them roam the streets devouring everything in their path, you ain't the Pied Piper!
> 
> The light green tinged frog will only boil if it lets itself boil - we live with our eyes wide shut. Looking, not believing what we see, yet hoping for a better day - so are the Palistinians, see where it gets them!
> 
> Bausch and Lomb once said "We can't change the way the world looks, but we can change the way you see it" We stare blindly through our lenses of hope - like fools ....
> 
> Lose your conscience, make your money, and hit the road!
> 
> Say out loud;  I don't give a sh_t!
> ...


With respect, this is simply another way of saying - "accept it, tolerate it, look the other was ... just get on with your own life ..." 

.... thus accepting that you are already dis-empowered ... victimized ... stripped of even your right to open your mouth ......

... exactly as you are intended to be by those wielding power ...

... for all the sheep on Animal Farm .......

This form of "stoic defeatism" is *exactly the culture* we all adopted in Zimbabwe during the so called "good years" - 1980 - 1990 ... and the rest is history ... because what you are dealing with is not just a scorpion ... it is a monster in the making ... that you choose to ignore at your peril .... like us 3.4 million Zimbos in the Diaspora.
Read ....

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## adrianh

> With respect, this is simply another way of saying - "accept it, tolerate it, look the other was ... just get on with your own life ..."


I clearly remember the 2 years that I spent in the army - I had no choice, I had to accept whatever came along. The name of the game was tolerating the situation for 2 years and then moving on.

It is not "stoic defeatism" - it is the ZEN art of "Not giving a Sh_t"

Yes, I am saying fly under the radar and look out for number 1. (Let the scorpion figure out how to get across the river itself - it has taken over the entire forest anyway)

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## ChrisNG53

> I clearly remember the 2 years that I spent in the army - I had no choice, I had to accept whatever came along. The name of the game was tolerating the situation for 2 years and then moving on.


 :Oops: 

I too "survived" the army in the same way. It's all you can do.

However, that still does not mean that you adopt "stoic defeatism" as a personal code. Just as, because you cannot remove a president or MEC you don't like, does not mean that you must thereafter forever "shut up" about what is unjust, wrong, diabolical .... It is a _non sequitur_ with respect. :Confused:  In my book I relate how, when I got the chance, I did my best to undermine and embarrass the army. It's what I could do.

South Africans quite correctly blame us Zimbos for our situation. WE DID adopt a creed of "stoic defeatism", and the scorpion became a monster.

Understand this ... if you are gonna be quiet, pliant and cowed (as those who wield power want you to be), one day you will be voiceless ... and it will have started because *you, yourself first gave up your voice!*

The reason why the Media Bill is not going to fly is because voices have risen up in opposition!

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Dave A (12-Jan-11)

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## adrianh

To fight for something you have to care enough about it in the first place. I don't care enough about this lot to be bothered.

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## Sparks

I certainly am. I have good Coloured, Chinese, Phillipino and Indian friends for years, but the fact remains, some people believe they are entitled to whatever they want and will stop at nothing to get it. If it means lowering the standard of education to achieve better pass rates, so be it. We already have a country with poor levels of education. As the Judge said "superficial" remedies are easier. The government saying they must pull up their socks and strive for higher standards would mean they agree with what whites said all along.

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## ChrisNG53

> I certainly am. I have good Coloured, Chinese, Phillipino and Indian friends for years


Appreciate your point. It is sad though that, 16 years after independence, having supposedly defeated racism, we still find ourselves forced to "think racially". It's actually a national preoccupation; an obsession that underpins just about everything. 

How tragic; after the great promise that Nelson Rolihlahla Mandela epitomized.

I have worked in Zimbabwe, SA, Botswana and Namibia. It was only in Namibia that I was absolutely unaware of the fact that I am Coloured. 

The Namibians are doing something right! .... wonderfully right!. I have tried to work it out. What I know is that the average Namibian can speak 4 languages. I even found that Black Namibians, at Keetmanshoop, will often speak to each other only in Afrikaans. WOW! 

It was wonderful living in Namibia. The Black people, in particular, seem to love you even more if you are a foreigner or ethnically different.

From that I deduce that a person who can speak the language of other ethnicities, *has crossed a significant barrier,* and has no sub-conscious emotional block about people who are different. 

"Man is a great wall builder
the Berlin Wall
the Wailing Wall of Jerusalem
But the wall
Most impregnable
Has a moat
Flowing with fright
Around his heart ..."
                                                  Oswald Mbuyiseni Mtshali (SA)

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## Justloadit

> The Namibians are doing something right! .... wonderfully right!.


The reason I believe is that the ruling party is only 1% point higher than the opposition at the polls, which ensures that they have to perform, or they will be out at the next election. This ensures that the politicians concentrate in solving the nations problems with out having to employ their friends and family. Their position is measured by their ability, and not by their connections.

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Dave A (14-Jan-11)

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## adrianh

I also spent time in Botswana, Namibia and Zambia.




> The Namibians are doing something right! .... wonderfully right!.


Yes, I fully agree. If I were to move anywhere in Africa it would be to Windhoek. 

It is amazing how one doesn't notice race in Namibia. Here is a thought - could it be because the people have vey similar accents and speech. Whereas in South Africa the different accents are not only noticeable but also encouraged through the use of 11 languages - Food for thought.

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## Dave A

I thought this is a strong point to consider.



> The reason I believe is that the ruling party is only 1% point higher than the opposition at the polls, which ensures that they have to perform, or they will be out at the next election. This ensures that the politicians concentrate in solving the nations problems with out having to employ their friends and family. Their position is measured by their ability, and not by their connections.


Not only do they have to be aware of their performance, there has to be a genuine underlying respect for democratic principles if they see the potential of not being the "ruling party" as real.

I actually think that's where a lot of the sh*t starts - when the majority party sees itself as the "ruling" party, not merely the party that represents most (but certainly not all) of the interests of the citizens of the country. Governments need to attend to the best interests of *all* its citizens, whether they support the majority party or not. 

When you're sensitive to the fact that you might be the minority party one day, you tend to be a little more sensitive to how the majority party might treat you and set good precedents as to how that relationship should be conducted.

Knowing you could be on the receiving end of your own medicine one day certainly encourages wise decisions.

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## ChrisNG53

> The reason I believe is that the ruling party is only 1% point higher than the opposition at the polls,


Oh no ... there are plenty perceived and other problems as regards government in Namibia. And their Home Affairs Department .... huh!!!!!

I am referring to the social fabric ... and the emotional intelligence of the general populace. 

Ordinary people in Namibia seem to without the _moat around the wall_ that is referred to in the poem by Mtshali. In SA we are much better at division than unity and acceptance of each other. And, as I have insisted in a previous post, it is not going to change as long as there has been no national reconciliation (including forgiveness) ... AND we have this climate of *official embedded racism.*

Having said that, I must admit that the Basters in Namibia really seem to want to be just left alone ... in the main. Ah well, it can never be perfect.

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## desA

Will SAmbabwe go the same way as Zimbabwe?

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## ChrisNG53

> Will SAmbabwe go the same way as Zimbabwe?


I do not think so. There is one HUGE difference about SA in relation to Zim and the rest of traditional Africa. It is what may be termed the *"Polokwane phenomenon".* 

You see, at Polokwana, something truly fantastic happened. The vote of _ordinary branch members removed the most powerful person in the country._

This could never have happened in Zim. You did not even discuss Mugabe, except with those closest to you, and in hushed tones. If you did, you could disappear ... as many did .... CIO, Mugabe's Gestapo would deal with you .... Zapiro would have been a candidate for "mineshaft internment".

*So, in SA, people are truly free ... and leaders are accountable.*

This freedom was hard won. Many gave their lives for it. Some were even "braaid" whilst their killers drank in celebration. It is a freedom that must not be wasted.

That is why it is so important to use your voice ... as the Tunisians have at last .... and not hunker down in stoic defeatism .....

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