# General Business Category > Technology Forum >  LCD, LED, Plasma and then 3D what affects what?

## wynn

I am getting to the stage where I am going to upgrade my ancient TV for a flat screen to be HD ready when it happens.

I am not too much into 3D because besides giving me a headache and making my eyes water, I think it is a passing fad.

What is the difference between LCD and LED and Plasma?

remember I am a 'Technodatyl' so easy English words will be appreciated.

I have an inkling that they are all Plasma and are lit by LED or other systems.
I surmise that LCD stands for (Liquid Crystal Display?) is that different to plasma?

Then most importantly, list in sequence which system is likely to be cheapest, last the longest and use the least electricity? so that the little old man I am can make an informed choice.    :Wink:

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## Justloadit

I recommend LED TV - it comes HDMI ready, probably has 3D - which is not the same as the crap glasses you use at a movie theatre, these are actually active 3 D glasses which receive a signal from the TV to enable a view which is something you have to experience. Having 3D with HDMI is really something to enjoy. I must be honest, I have only view the one movie in 3D with HDMI called the life of PI, and I tell you what, that imagery is really something that you have to experience.

The LED really refers to the back lighting, and the screen is LCD anyway. And being LED is the most power efficient and the lightest in the range.

Best is to experience the TVs at your local shop, and see which is the fancier one that you like.

Watching sport in HDMI is really great, the colours are so clear and the image is so clear.

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wynn (25-Feb-14)

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## irneb

Type of Screen
Simple explanation for the screen type: CRT is a coating on glass which fluoresces when bombarded with a stream of electrons. Plasma is a lot of very tiny coloured lights. LCD is one large flat white light shining though a set of tiny dots which can be opened and closed, each of these has a colour filter - light is mostly a fluorescent tube bent around to make one solid light (like a thin neon tube zig-zaging across the rectangle). LED is usually the same as LCD, only difference is the large light behind is flatter and more efficient - tends to be LED (Light emitting diodes). The VERY expensive LED (or "true" LED screen) actually uses these as the coloured lights and throws away the LCD part - then it starts working similar to Plasma.

A more technical description:
CRT (Cathode Ray Tube): The old bulky TV's.Plasma: Each dot (pixel) is 3 very tiny lights (similar to a fluorescent tube) - one red, the 2nd green and the 3rd blue. Depending on the signal for that particular pixel, the brightness between the 3 gives the colour. This used to be extremely expensive, but since around mid 2000's a much cheaper way of making them was found.LCD (Liquid Crystal Display): Each dot has 3 panes which let the light through from a light source (in this case a large fluorescent tube array / neon tubes) - each of the 3 has a filter over it (red/green/blue). The amount each of these 3 gets opened determines the colour. The panes work the same way any LCD does - i.e. the same as a calculator-display.LED (Light Emitting Diode), the normal type: Exactly the same thing as a LCD screen, only difference being that instead of the light behind being made by fluorescent / neon tubes (which take space and become hot) these are replaced by more efficient LEDs (Light Emitting Diodes).You do get "true" LED where it works like a plasma without back-lighting, but using extremely tiny LEDs instead of the microscopic fluorescents - though these screens are exorbitantly expensive (especially when they're large). You find some newer smart phones using this technology (e.g. Apple's retina display). 

Resolution/Definition
Simple explanation about the "definition", or "resolution": Normal TV (like from SABC) is the same as the old VHS tapes. SD (Standard Resolution) is the same as DVD's. HD is what you get from Blue Ray discs (usually).

HD (High Definition) simply means that there are more of these pixels over the surface of the screen - you can get HD in any of the above (even in the old CRT).

As a means to figure out how many pixels you'd need - say you have a digital camera. Have you ever got those photos printed out? If so how many Mega Pixels was your camera? Try having it printed to a page the same size as your TV and see when you start noticing dots of colour as opposed to a picture. The larger your screen and the closer you sit to it, the more pixels you need to get a clear picture instead of a blurry bunch of dots.

 E.g. to put into same measurement as you get for digital cameras:
Old TV (at least since SA started showing colour TV): around 320x260 pixels (VHS/VCD quality) = 83200 = *0.08 Mega Pixel*SD (Standard Definition - DVD quality or sometimes called 480) has around 720 pixels from left to right and 480 from top to bottom (i.e. 720x480 = 345600 = *0.3 Mega Pixel*).HD-Ready can mean it's actually SD but will accept HD video by down-scaling it so it fits on the SD screen. Though it might also mean it's what's known as half-HD ... see nextHalf HD, or also called 720: 1280x720 = 921600 = *0.9 Mega Pixels*Full HD or 1080: 1920x1080 = 2073600 = *2.07 Mega Pixels*These are usually suffixed with p/i - p (progressive) means it changes each line of the screen for every frame of the video. i (interlaced) means it changes every odd line for the 1st frame, then every even line for the second - you get some which work on each 3rd line. P is always better, but i isn't "too" bad if you really need to save on cost, though I'd suggest you test and see first.You get even higher than this, but would only be needed for stuff like cinemas or extremely large screens (i.e. measured in several meters across). And even if you have one of these, no Blue Ray disc or HD signal will give you those resolutions, so your screen will use multiple pixels to represent one dot. Some standards are UHD (Ultra High Definition) 4K (2160) and 8K (4320). 

All that said, most channels in SA are not HD. Even the "HD" channels on DSTV is actually the 720 (half HD). The only time (at present in SA) where you'd be using a full HD to its maximum would be if you're playing a full HD Blue Ray disc (note these can also still be 480 or 720) or a full HD (or better) video file from a PC. Overseas you do get some places where full HD is the norm, and even some where you get UHD 2K/4K - but don't hold your breath for us just yet - lots of infrastructure needs to be set up before they can broadcast at these resolutions.

3D
3d simply turns some pixels on for one eye and others for the other eye. How it splits them is usually supplier dependent. Some use special glasses which are polarised (left might be vertical and right horizontal). Others use glasses which blank out between frames so your left eye sees only the odd frames and the right only the even. Some newer screens are stating they're glass-less 3D - working similar to those plastic pictures you used to get in Lucky-Packets where the picture changes if you tilt it (i.e. one eye sees one side of the picture, the other sees the other side). Though this last one sometimes makes it very difficult to see the image correctly - you might need to shuffle around a bit to sit in the correct spot.

A very old version of this was using coloured filters on the glasses (red and blue) - that also went the way of the dodo, so you might be correct about it being a fad.

Usually a 3D screen can be used like a normal 2D by simply turning off this splitting of pixels, but the other way round (i.e. take a 2D DVD and try to play it as a 3D video) tends to be extremely problematic. Usually if it wasn't photographed as 3D (i.e. 2 separate cameras taking pictures at different angles like your eyes do in real life) chances are the picture will be blurry and/or cause head-aches. Even if it was taken as true 3D then it depends on the distance between the cameras and their focal lengths - if these are too far from a normal eye's real-life specifications the picture would look weird / blurry and could also cause head-aches. And then you do get that some people simply find that any 3D causes issues - that's a physiological issue (either to do with their eyes or the way their brain interprets what their eyes "see").

I'd suggest 3D only if you're one of the less unfortunate who can actually handle 3D, and also only if most of what you're going to watch is recorded in some decent 3D. Unless you can find a 3D screen for the same/lower price as a similar 2D (other specifications being equal) AND you can turn its 3D off - this I don't think is possible, it would be like getting more for less (which no business would be willing to do for their customers).

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wynn (25-Feb-14)

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## Justloadit

My HISENSE TV, you can turn on and off the 3D at will.

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## Marq

I have a smart led 3d hd tv.
The only thing I know is that it isnt smart. 
The rest works ok though.

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## newBix

Get the cheapest LED LCD TV you can find and the most expensive UPS [like the one you use with a desktop pc] you can find. They dislike power dips.

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## Justloadit

> Get the cheapest LED LCD TV you can find and the most expensive UPS [like the one you use with a desktop pc] you can find. They dislike power dips.


I would rather say the lowest cost LED TV you can afford.

Just remember the price of TVs drop as new models come out, but, the exchange rate will trip you up on a latest brand TV.

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## iLLuDeano

Depends on what you want to use it for. if you want to browes YouTube etc, take a smart TV. If you really enjoy movies and thats all you watch, get 3D. If you just use it for a hour every night to watch the news, maby one episode of a series etc etc. Take plain LED, it's the cheapest and looks just as amazing as a TV with Smart and 3D. See the reason why TV's are so smooth is because of the Hrtz, (Framerate)

Newer models run 200htz, that is waaaay over the top! In fact, many cameras don't record that quality so you will just see some lag on the screen in between movements of actors on screen. So a 6 series samsung and up will have higher htz. I specifically bought a 5series @ Dion Wired and it runs 100htz, now THAT looks awesome and it's just right to support almost any series or movie without seeing how crap the quality of camera's where that they used. That is just my opinion/ About 3D, in most cases the quality of the TV is so good you can actually see the digital aspectys of movies (Refering to The Hobbit) I hated it on a 7Series Samsung, I could see how "Fake" everything looked.

Another thing, if you like your sport, a 7Series would be awesome! Then by all means go 200htz. Although, sport might be the only thing that looks ok on high tech screens like that.

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wynn (25-Feb-14)

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## wynn

It must be 10 yrs or longer since I bought a TV so my thechnology is also as old as me and the dinosaurs.

So it looks like I need to get LED but I now have questions about HD!

If I get full HD will the local TV broadcast show normally because they are not HD yet? and must I get a new DSTV Decoder to accommodate HD?

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## Justloadit

The TV has HDMI, VGA and RCA  inputs to it, so if your equipment is not HDMI compatible, they will use the RCA connectors. Use the VGA input if you want to use a PC. Any equipment which is HDMI, will have an HDMI output. You then select the input channel to view on the TV via the menu.

You do not need a new decoder for your TV, but I strongly recommend you get the latest decoders, to watch the sports channels and some movies on the HDMI quality. The decoder automatically modifies the signal on the HDMI output accordingly.

Just be weary, you require a special HDMI cable to connect to your TV, sometimes they supply one, but it may only be 1.5m long. You do get longer ones, but do cost a small fortune though.

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wynn (26-Feb-14)

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## irneb

Yep, for me as well ... connections are probably the most troublesome aspect. HD/LED/LCD/Plasma/3d/Hz ... those you can generally see the difference in the shop. But connectors you need to think about, since you're only going to notice the issues when you get it home and try to plug it in.

If all your equipment use HDMI cables (connectors are about the shape and size of USB) you should be fine with just about anything. Some have component input (like the 3 round plugs you used to get for video/dvd players/recorders). Some have VGA/DVI like computer screens. Just take note that for HD you require either HDMI/DVI/VGA - the others tend to not work so well at the higher resolution.

Usually (note some cheaper models skimp a bit on this) play low res video quite well. So viewing something like SABC (or DSTV's standard channels) should simply be scaled so it uses the full screen by using multiple pixels for each dot of the image. Sometimes this causes you to actually see the "dots" though (or worse it distorts by stretching/squashing the proportions) - I'd suggest you ask the shop to show a normal TV broadcast in addition to the BD movie they usually use so you can see if it works decently with current TV channels.

If you want to get something which will last for at least the next 10 years, then it might be a good idea to have something with a network / wifi connection too. Overseas most TV channels have either gone out of business or moved to on-line. In the US stuff like NetFlix have become ubiquitous as has similar stuff in Europe (even BBC now "broadcasts across the internet). There's been stuff in the news about SA's broadcasts becoming digital (not satellite but digital radio), this will require a set-top box, but I fear they're doing too little too late - on-line (through the internet) seems to be the future (at least if you look at the rest of the world). So to be ready when (and if) SA's internet becomes fast and cheap enough to watch live video, you should get something which will work easily with a set-top-box. For me, I already watch local TV shows only once in a blue moon (usually only sport), since I can usually view shows which are a year ahead of anything on MNet/DSTV while their quality is also full HD (nothing on DSTV is that).

Edit: Overseas the trend is to get TV's with built-in media centres (i.e. set-top-box built in). These are usually something like an Android operating system (like on smart-phones / tablets) with a program specifically designed for use on TV with a remote. Alternatively they go for HTPC (Home Theatre Personal Computer) - see my thread here about me trying to find something decent: http://www.theforumsa.co.za/forums/s...your-old-phone

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wynn (26-Feb-14)

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## bjsteyn

I baught a Samsung 46" LED Smart 3D TV. And i am impressed with the quality of picture and features that it pack.

There are one or two things that arn't perfect. The motion sensing for controlling the TV doesn't work that great, although the voice recognition works almost perfect. Also things like when having to turn up the volume via voice it only increases/descrease by one at a time.
If my volume is 20 and i want to get it to 50 i have to say "Hi TV, Volume Up, Volumen Up, Volume Up, Volume Up, Volume up, Volume up x 25 more times" I woul like to say "Volume up by 5" or something. Don't know if there is a way mabe to this. But dont see anything in the guide.

Secondly when trying to connect to media on my server using either Plex or Samsung Link the network connection just breaks at times and every time i add new media to my server is such a mission for the TV to pick up the new media. Also if there is media in folder that the TV doesn't recognize it doesn't want to read the folder. The samsung link web interface for configuring shared folders doesn't work so i had to edit the SQLLite database manually and tried to use Plex as-well, but it also have problems also with the interface and media being read.

Thirdly, when watching movies form my server directly threw the media player on the TV it has an soap opera effect, and doesn't look like a movie. I am linking my TV to my pc via HDMI, and movies has much more of a movie feel playing it with nero showtime or vlc media player.

I haven't played a movie threw a DVD player yet. But baught a 3D blue ray external dvd drive to hook up with my pc. Am still to get a movie and test it out.

Overall i am very impressed, there are just a few things that bug me , that i wish samsung would have sorted out. Hopefully i can update the firmware/software on the TV when samsung release updates and that they will fix the issues.

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## irneb

AFAIK the menu stuff only Samsung themselves will be able to fix through a firmware update. BTW, that TV is basically something like an ARM processor with a Linux-like OS. There are some custom stuff you could install (but similar to custom ROM's for Android it would probably void the waranty): http://smart-home-blog.com/2010/05/2...nd-lg-lcd-tvs/

As for movies looking poorer when viewing through the TV's network interface, that's probably because you're limited to DLNA (one of the reasons that custom OS was started, so it could link directly to any file share Linux's built-in NFS / the linux-to-windows link CIFS/Samba, or UPnP which means it can even then directly view from your Media Player's own library. If it would make the movie look better is a matter of some other factors:
The network speed (usually if on WiFi it tends to drop connection from my experience - and this happens on all WiFi connected stuff, not just TV's), if you can't get throughput of at least 30MBytes/sec with constant connection you'd have a difficult time playing a full HD video across the network. This is why I always try to get a wired LAN cable for especially video, and a 100MBit/sec is not enough for HD, it's just about good enough for SD (DVD) - so 1GB/s is what I tend to aim for. Some WiFi advertise 150MB/s or 300, or 450, and the newest AC standard "advertises" around 800MB/s, though from what I've seen that's only theory on NO practise.Internal drivers / codecs may not be able to play that format, or possibly not at its full resolutions. You might be able to obtain better drivers / codecs through a firmware update and/or custom OS.Hardware might be insufficient to transcode the compressed video at its highest resolutions, sometimes the drivers/codecs could help with this if they're more efficient - but chances are that if hardware is too slow, then you're stuck. You might need to transcode the AVI/MKV/etc. files to use a codec which works easier through the TV - do this on your PC through something like VirtualDub. Though easier usually then means the file is larger and thus means network traffic becomes more of an issue.

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## irneb

BTW, if you do plan to view movies / other which you've got stored on a local server/PC/phone/NAS/etc. It seems the best option is to connect using CIFS/Samba (sometimes referred to as SMB). UPnP seems to be a bit of a minimalist connection system - not too well suited for stuff like fast-forward / extra features like BD's comments and highlights / extra files like other sound tracks / subtitles. DLNA is simply a standard which works similar to UPnP. You might want to see these for reference:
http://hdliving.com/learning-center/.../06/02/dlna-it
http://www.mpcclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=24893

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## montronic

I also prefer a LED TV, but not really a fan of the built in smart tv features. I prefer to connect a setup box (1st choice) or even a raspberry pi, as I usually find the built in software of the TV to slow for my liking. It also allows me to run XBMC which I really like

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## irneb

> It also allows me to run XBMC which I really like


+1 IMO it's the absolute best menu system for on-line/local fileserver based movies/tv series I've ever seen in any media device. It makes everything else look amateurish (at best).

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## Marq

The interface, speed and controls of my Samsung smart tv reminds me of windows 3 and dos scenarios.

This flashed to mind .
Who remembers the ZX Spectrum?

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## irneb

> The interface, speed and controls of my Samsung smart tv reminds me of windows 3 and dos scenarios.


Ouch ... just OUCH!

Even something like OpenElec (Linux) installed on a Raspberry Pi (i.e. similar to the CPU/Motherboard of a smart phone of 5 years ago) and running XMBC as the media menu performs smoothly and without glitches. And it's not as if XBMC is a text-only menu system. Just take a look at some of its screenshots: https://www.google.co.za/search?q=xb...iw=948&bih=780

I generally prefer the Amber skin though. Love it's system of newest & recommended movies and TV shows: https://www.google.co.za/search?q=xb...icial&tbm=isch




> This flashed to mind .
> Who remembers the ZX Spectrum?


You mean this:

Yeah, that looks as if it just might be in the same class as my remote ...  :Online2long:

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## irneb

> Raspberry Pi (i.e. similar to the CPU/Motherboard of a smart phone of 5 years ago)


E.g. the R-Pi's specs: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raspber...Specifications

My old Android's: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Droid_2
the one prior to my phone the: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorola_Droid

So Pi= 400MHz ARM-CPU + 256MB Ram, MotoDroid2 = 1GHz ARM-CPU + 512MB RAM, "Droid 1" = 600MHz ARM & 256MB RAM.

I wonder what idiotic hardware Samsung deemed sufficient for your TV? They must've specially made such inferior stuff - you can't buy it if you tried (not even second-hand).

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## Marq

Is this not similar to your new smart tv screen? :Rofl: 
This is a Commodore64 geos screen from 1982.

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## Marq

These words could sum up the situation.
Even Larry the Lounge Lizard understood.

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## IanF

I got a raspberry pi for Christmas and have put on Xbian, I did have to get a class 10 sd card to stop the playback from stuttering. 

I must look at new skins which ones do you recommend?

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## irneb

Yep, even on PC's it's recommended to have your HDD be something faster than an entry-level thing. They actually recommend a SSD to get the absolute best performance - though I think that's simply overkill to the greatest possible extent. It's mainly because XBMC is constantly reading/writing to its database. Else you can set it up to link to a server DB (Something like MySQL running on any PC in your network), but then your db queries are running across the network.

At the moment I can't say from my own experience.I'm using XBMC through an old laptop (Celeron 2.1GHz + 1GB RAM and  Radeon card running Lubuntu and XBMC). I used this since it has its own  DVD player/writer - which means it doubles as my DVD player. I'd have  liked BD ... but ...

On this system it runs just perfect on the original 80GB 5400rpm HDD through an old ISA connection (not even using SATA). I can even get extremely eye-candy skins running smoothly on this (stuff like Aeon run without glitches), so I think the SSD advise is someone trying to over compensate for something else.

But for Memory Cards (like the SD you use as the Pi's "HDD") low rated means it's VERY slow (more like the speeds from an old floppy disc). As I said before, you need around 30MBytes/sec and you'd be good to go (most HDDs except those from the 90's can easily reach this), some SD's have difficulty reaching 5MB/s.



> I must look at new skins which ones do you recommend?


Anyhow, from XBMC's forums the general consensus is that for Pi's you need a skin with as little as possible automatic movements. So the default Confluence is about right, others you might try: Metropolis, Quartz, Silk. Stay away from Neon, Aeon, and the like. Try something with less transparency if possible.

It's very easy to install and uninstall if you don't like it. You don't even need any restarting to change from one skin to another.

That's how I found Amber to be the one I like ... tried around 10 of those listed in XBMC's addon list. Some of them have awesome graphical effects (but I fear you need a GPU for those - so Pi's won't be smooth), others have huge quantities of extra features. Some are specifically designed for touch screens, while others work better with a mouse, and others better designed for remote / keyboard. It's all about the usability first, and then the eye candy 2nd - abverb: "Form Follows Function" needs to be adhered to:
First find out what the available features are, by actually testing the skin, seeing if it took away some function which you liked in another, or added something you might use often.Only then look at which appears more pretty.
This is why I didn't go for Aeon or Transparency, nice to look at, difficult (or less easy) to use.

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## Marq

> I got a raspberry pi for Christmas and have put on Xbian, I did have to get a class 10 sd card to stop the playback from stuttering.


Not sure what you have got here. From what I understand - a smart remote?

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## irneb

> Not sure what you have got here. From what I understand - a smart remote?


 :Applaud: 

You should be in standup ....

Sorry, the idea is the R-Pi is like a mini computer. You can actually use it like any computer. In fact it's a better and faster PC than the old Pentiums were. Only it fits on a space about the size of a credit card. This is typically how you can plug different things linking into it: http://blogs.it.ox.ac.uk/nexus/files...spberryPi1.jpg

You can add all sorts of extra expansions to it if you like, but default it has HDMI out, 2 or 3 USB2 connections and 1x 1GB/s LAN port. The motherboard itself (the green plate on which the components are plugged into has a space for a SD card (top of that image) - which becomes the PC's hard drive for installing the operating system and programs.

Then you buy a casing so it doesn't look like you're a PC mechanic with parts laying about your lounge: https://www.google.co.za/search?q=ra...iw=948&bih=780

Then you can use that as a replacement for the Dumb TV's menus, by simply leaving the TV showing just the R-Pi connection and having it show it's much nicer and smarter menus instead.

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## AndyD

How do you watch TV Wynn? 
Do you have a bluray or DVD player that you use regularly?
Do you have a home network with movies/series stored on other PC's you'd like to watch?
How big is your lounge/TV room, how far do you sit away from your TV?
Do you have other devices you'd like to be able to plug into your TV such as a Madiator or portable hard drive or even a camera?
Do you currently have a separate sound system for the audio or do you just use the speakers in your old TV?
Do you just want to use your TV as a TV or would you like to be able to browse internet and skype etc.

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## IanF

Thanks irneb lots to think about. I use a 1tb drive in a dock to store the files.

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## irneb

> Thanks irneb lots to think about. I use a 1tb drive in a dock to store the files.


No prob! I started with something similar - but ran out of space too quickly (what with full HD movies taking up so much space). Now have the 4 HDDs inside my Linux server/desktop PC (500GB + 1TB +2TB and yesterday replaced a 250GB with a 3TB), though there I'm still a newbie: had a stupid problem when I replaced the disc, learnt something new about Linux: http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...el-4175496639/

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## Marq

I am learning stuff here - this is great - didnt know about R-Pi's before.
Thanks for the input.
I'll try not to include any Smart jokes. :Wink:

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## irneb

> I'll try not to include any Smart jokes.


No! Please don't ... please don't ... please don't STOP!  :Rofl:

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## irneb

> I must look at new skins which ones do you recommend?


You might want to look at this thread: http://forum.xbian.org/thread-139.html

Apparently my favourite (amber) doesn't actually use up too much of the Pi's CPU (on that test only 20% as opposed to something like Aeon MQ at 98%). It seems to use even less CPU than those others recommended, so I'd advise you try it.

Or look at these guys testing it on a R-Pi: 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3R6S1cgCWhU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHfK-_tWzRU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErWF2sYgJec

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## wynn

> How do you watch TV Wynn? 
> Do you have a bluray or DVD player that you use regularly?
> Do you have a home network with movies/series stored on other PC's you'd like to watch?
> How big is your lounge/TV room, how far do you sit away from your TV?
> Do you have other devices you'd like to be able to plug into your TV such as a Madiator or portable hard drive or even a camera?
> Do you currently have a separate sound system for the audio or do you just use the speakers in your old TV?
> Do you just want to use your TV as a TV or would you like to be able to browse internet and skype etc.


Thanks Andy, I was lost in 'Geek' for a while there.

I really only watch DSTV, I would tune local SABC 1,2,3 and eTV but they are on the DSTV bouquet already I would like to get a new PVR eventually, I have a DVD player but it is not connected, it would be connected by wires if it was.
The reason I don't have the DVD connected is I watch too much TV already and movies would just cut into my sleep time.
I sit about 10 feet (3M) away from the screen and use the TV speakers,(I would probably get another meter when I dump the old tv and mount the flat screen on the wall)
I might want to get surround sound at the same time.
No no browsing or skyping, my office is just down the passage and all of that happens there.

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## irneb

Sorry if this thread evolved off topic.  :Whistling: 

From what you're saying: You want something which you're going to hang on the wall and only watch DSTV. Perhaps later add a DVD/BD and a surround system.

For the hanging on the wall, I'd suggest you go with a LED. They're usually a lot slimmer than LCD/Plasma - and tend to stay cooler so you don't need as much vent space behind. Also check that the connections won't mean you have to keep it way from the wall - prefer to get connections towards the sides / bottom (not at the edges of the screen) in stead of sticking straight out backwards.

Because you're not going to use any onboard menus - forget all those posts. You're happy with DSTV's own menu - so the only time you're ever going to see the TV's is when you set it to show the DSTV connection.

You'd need a TV with at least 2 HDMI inputs - one for DSTV and the other for your "future" DVD/BD player. Preferably you'd want an audio out as well (either HDMI/Optical/Coax) to send to your future sound system. It's much nicer to have one place to control (i.e. from the TV) than to remember to also set your sound system to use the same DSTV/Player as you've just set your TV to display.

Alternatively, some sound systems have a pass-through feature for multiple HDMI's. I.e. to change from DSTV to the DVD you set the sound system's "channel" and it then sends the video signal to the TV. You don't need to touch your TV's remote.

Because you're referring to BD (Blue Ray Disc) - you'd want a full HD.

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wynn (04-Mar-14)

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## AndyD

I'd pretty much agree with Irneb. I'd suggest strongly you spend the extra and get a decent 5.1 or 7.1 surround system to go with your TV, it will enhance your viewing pleasure enormously. Built-in TV speakers never fail to disappoint, most of the time they're basically overgrown laptop speakers with little resolution and very poor frequency response curves.

I'd also suggest you get a TV with a USB port and a good range of built-in codecs for movie and audio playback. A codec is just the software or program that decodes a compressed movie file so it can be played and allows you to use a flashdrive or portable harddrive directly into the TV or via a standard USB cable. It might be something you don't do at the moment but it is the way forward and I'm sure you'll use this feature more and more in future. Many TV's have limited codecs which means thay're picky and choosey about what movies they'll play so it's something to consider when making your choice.

I'd be looking for a TV with support for;

mkv, avi, MPEG and mp4 containers

MPEG-2, MPEG-4, H.264/MPEG-4 AVC and maybe WMV video formats but it wouldn't be a dealbreaker if Windows proprietary formats weren't supported.

AAC, AC3, DTS, PCM, LPCM, MP3, FLAC and maybe WMA audio formats.

3D and smart features it doesn't sound like you'll use so I would aviod the latest and greatest 3D smart ranges which would be a waste of money for you.

Plasma or LCD or LED? Good question and TBH with most TV's produced in recent years it's much of a muchness. I personally like plasma.....but saying that I bought an LED TV a year ago because it better suited my needs. It's mostly down to budget and personal taste.

Best manufacturer? My choice is Sumsung but there are other good ones. Sony are good picture but I avoid Sony because of lack of codecs any USB support etc. I have a Bang and Oulfsen Beovision in my bedroom which is a throwback to times gone by when money was no object, nice TV if your budget will accomodate but at 10 times the price of a mid-range Samsung I doubt you'll be interested. The mother-in-law recently bought an LG led and for what she paid I can't fault it apart from it being a bit picky what video formats it will play from a flashdrive. One thing I would caution against is generic and store home-brands. I know a few people who've opted for these because it looks like you get the same spec as a global brand but for cheaper. Believe me there's some crap ones!! I'd stick with a Samsung/LG etc and avoid the Sinotec and Dixon etc.

Next question, how much moola you got?

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wynn (04-Mar-14)

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## irneb

> I'd pretty much agree with Irneb. I'd suggest strongly you spend the extra and get a decent 5.1 or 7.1 surround system to go with your TV, it will enhance your viewing pleasure enormously. Built-in TV speakers never fail to disappoint, most of the time they're basically overgrown laptop speakers with little resolution and very poor frequency response curves.


+1, that's usually where those salesmen get you. I've yet to see any new TV with even acceptable sound, never mind "decent". Even my laptop's speakers sound better. And my PC's speakers are definitely better. So you can imagine just how poor the built-in speakers are, I'd go so far as to say they're comparable to your cellphone's speaker.

If budget constraints is an issue, then be warned - decent sound systems could mean you need to sell your car. But not to worry, nearly anything's better than the built-in speakers. Even if you don't go with a full fledged surround system (i.e. 5 to 7 speakers and a subwoofer - 5.1 or 6.1 or 7.1), just a decent hi-fi quality stereo system would enhance your experience tremendously. Even some hifi's these days come standard with HDMI inputs and pass through so you can use them as a sound system for your TV. Even if you have an old hifi (i.e. from the 90's) I'd opt to get analogue audio outputs into that hifi's AUX port instead of trying to listen to the either too soft and/or distorted crackling from the TV - though it might mean usability is a bit poorer as you'd need to set the hifi to the Aux channel whenever you want to watch TV.

I've had some good experience from this: http://www.philips.co.za/c/home-thea...sb2313_12/prd/
Though that was bought quite a few years ago (for around R1500). It's a 2.1 (i.e. 2 stereo speakers with a woofer for base sounds). Not "great" but enough for my small lounge (around 3x4m). Has some pseudo surround effects, but that I disregard (you never get the same effect with this fake surround stuff - it basically uses an echo to produce the impression that the sound comes from behind/to the side of you). What is nice about this is its inputs - if your TV can't handle too many (e.g. only has one HDMI) then this is exactly the sort of thing you'd be after. Not to mention, I've actually lost my TV remote since I've yet to actually use it - all channel switching goes through this "soundbar" as does volume +/-/mute - though even that I do very seldom (since my media centre can handle most of what I need to "adjust").

Personally if I was going to buy my "home theatre" (seeing as I very seldom actually watch "TV") I would go for something like this (or a full sound system) - then a really impressive PC screen instead of a "TV". To me the screen should be just that - a screen. I've got a media centre to manage everything using a very good menu system, DVD player/external disc/network share for my movies, a sound system for my sounds, a decoder for watching DSTV ... why should the screen have all this stuff inside (only in inferior quality). If the quality was comparable then I might think about reducing cables, but it's so far behind that I don't mind a few cables hidden behind the shelf. It seems like such a waste to me, they can throw all that S#!T out and make it cheaper. Especially seeing as they tend to use the most inferior C#@P they can possibly find to stick in there (every manufacturer including the bigname brands).

E.g. if I want a screen to suit my lounge (i.e. around the same distance away as yours 3 to 4 m) with impressive quality and decent sound with lots of connectivity and extremely easy usage I'd rather want something like this: http://www.samsung.com/africa_en/con.../LH46UEPLGC/XY
Than something like this: http://www.samsung.com/africa_en/con...UA46F6800AKXXA
Simply because I'd only use the stuff available from the 1st, all the extras in the 2nd are superfluous to me. And price-wise I'd be saving between 20% and 40% depending on where I buy it:
http://www.pricecheck.co.za/offers/5...ormat+Display/
http://www.pricecheck.co.za/offers/4...+46%22+LED+TV/

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wynn (04-Mar-14)

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## wynn

> Next question, how much moola you got?


I will have about 7 grand.

I like the idea of a computer screen with PVR and the rest but I am a real 'Technodactyl/phobe' and would be afraid that I would blow the budget on something that won't work properly.

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## irneb

Ok for that, you'd probably not be able to go much larger than a 36" (i.e. similar to a typical old box TV size), but for your size room you'd not need anything over a 50" (that would just look silly - might as well then go for a projector instead, to get that cinema experience  :Stick Out Tongue: ). So anything between 36 to 50 should be sufficient for the distance you're sitting away from it, but I'd rather go with a full HD 36", than a HD ready 50". So check for the largest full HD you can afford.

 And to keep the price down while getting a decent resolution, you'd probably want to check Plasma or LCD first (I fear a decent sized LED is going to get very close to your limit or surpass it, so don't worry about the hype surrounding it - it's major benefits over the other 2 if resolution/size is the same is that it uses less elec and is flatter, quality will be much the same). Follow those links to the PriceCheck website, it lists most of the stuff available in SA so you can at least get an indication of the relative prices (might even be able to use it for some bargaining power). There are definitely some 43" plasmas well within your range (e.g. the JVC full HD plasma 43") - so you would have some spare cash to look for a soundbar or the like. But definitely check in the shop how it looks and operates before making up your mind.

As someone's said already, try to stay away from the non-big-brand names. Try to stick with Samsung/LG/Sony/similar (I might class JVC/Telefunken/Sharp/Panasonic/Toshiba as a 2nd tier just above the stuff like Hisense/Rectron/Ellies/PVision/Benq/etc.), though some of the others aren't "bad" you might find that service isn't too great. I do see that some PC-big-names also make TV's, though I'm not sure how well their interfaces go - I know brands like Acer/Asus/Mercer/Nec make reasonably good PC screens, so their TV's might be similar.

If you want to go for the PC screen thing, then I'd first ask a few extra questions:

Do you already have some sort of sound system (hifi or the like)?Can you explain (or better yet take a picture and post here) what connections your decoder has?Or if you're going to get a PVR one - which model?

Alternatively, you can always later go for a sound system and live with some crappy sound for now while you have a decent screen.

On a side-note, you might have noticed that some screens/TVs have glossy glass and others have a matt finish. I like the matt finish personally since it doesn't show reflections as much, but if you've got direct sunlight onto your screen (which you must avoid at all costs) then glossy is the only one which might allow you to still see some picture.

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wynn (05-Mar-14)

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## AndyD

Okay, I'd caution about using a PC monitor as a TV for several reasons. 

The first is price. You're going to pay considerably more for a PC monitor which is the same physical size as a TV.

Secondly a PC monitor often has different plugs and sockets to a TV so it can sometimes cause issues when you want to connect devices such as decoders, set-top boxes, DVD players etc etc.

Thirdly the native resolutions of monitors and TV's are fundamentally different. In the good old days both monitors and TV's were all 4:3 so if the screen was 40cm wide it would be 30cm high. Nowadays the width to height ratio of a monitor is usually 16:10 whereas TV's are usually 16:9. This might not seem important but it means if you play media such as movies on a monitor they don't physically fit so you're either stuck with the black bars filling in the gaps or even worse the software that's responsible for playing the movie will 'adjust' the picture to fit the screen. This means playback is at a non-native resolution and the result is poor quality picture. Likewise if you use a TV to play games that were made for use on a PC the game graphics will be native 16:10 and the quality will suffer on a 16:9 TV. Also to add insult to injury the TV is likely to be larger so the poor quality will be even more pronounced.

In a nutshell (I'm trying to avoid complex technical explanations) a monitor and a TV lay the picture onto the screen in different ways. If you want to read about the differences Google _'anamorphic playback'_, _'interlacing'_, _'progressive scanning'_ etc. My best advice would be to buy a TV if want a TV and buy a monitor if you're using it primarily connected to a PC.

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wynn (05-Mar-14)

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## irneb

> The first is price. You're going to pay considerably more for a PC monitor which is the same physical size as a TV.


I've seen that too, but only when the screen is in the region above 60". the reason being that the PC screens at that size are usually UHD (i.e. in the 3480x2160 or even 7680x4320 pixel range) while the TV's stay with while 1920x1020. It's because a PC screen is designed to be viewed while you sit very close to it, and at those sizes sitting 1m away a "standard" full HD will show you the dots. For TV's this generally doesn't matter because with those size screens you're meant to sit at least 5m away - so you won't notice the "large" dots. Though you do still get PC displays at similar resolutions, e.g. this 82" Samsung is only 1020p (1920x1020) at 16:9 - around same price as this 75" TV. While the other way round is also true, e.g. UHD TV's: http://www.samsung.com/za/consumer/t...evision/uhd-tv




> Secondly a PC monitor often has different plugs and sockets to a TV so it can sometimes cause issues when you want to connect devices such as decoders, set-top boxes, DVD players etc etc.


That's probably true. Most PC screens would only have 1 (or perhaps 2) inputs. In general a DVI input instead of HDMI, but you do get those with HDMI these days also. They also don't have remote sensors built-in like TVs do, so for the remote you might need something else.




> Thirdly the native resolutions of monitors and TV's are fundamentally different. In the good old days both monitors and TV's were all 4:3 so if the screen was 40cm wide it would be 30cm high. Nowadays the width to height ratio of a monitor is usually 16:10 whereas TV's are usually 16:9.


This is a bit of a yes..and...no situation, I'd say 16:10 is about 40% of the PC screens you get these days. All TV's are 16:9, but PC's vary quite often. I've even seen some PC screens at 2.35:1 (i.e. the same as a cinema screen - more than twice as wide than they're high), thus it could even go the other way round - the black bars on the sides as the screen's proportions means it's wider than the video's 16:9. But you also do get PC screens at 16:9, e.g. my desktop's 23" is a 16:9.

So yes, caution should be applied if you go with PC screens. Best would be to get one with at least one connection for each of your equipment so you don't need a intermediate device to "convert" one cable into another. And to get a screen with an aspect ratio of 16:9 with apples-for-apples comparison of resolutions.

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wynn (05-Mar-14)

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## wynn

So it looks like I will settle for a 36" or 40" LED in either Samsung, Sony or one of the other big brand names.

Thanks very much for the help!

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## IanF

Be careful of the sony the playback from USB is very limited, take your own stick and test it in store.

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wynn (06-Mar-14)

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## irneb

> Be careful of the sony the playback from USB is very limited, take your own stick and test it in store.


+1 ... best to go test in the store. If you don't have a USB, and not going to use such things, then it probably doesn't matter.

Also check what the screen actually is. I'd go so far as to rent a BlueRay movie for the day when I go to these shops and have them play it for me there - stops them from choosing some special purpose video they coded to look best on a crappy screen. Choose something with lots of action and preferably a lot of fine detail, e.g. something like Hugo might be a perfect test. And then also a standard SABC channel to see how it handles poor video sources.

 E.g. higher price doesn't necessarily mean it's a better screen. E.g. compare these 2:
http://www.pricecheck.co.za/offers/4...ctshare+Movie/http://www.pricecheck.co.za/offers/5...+Hd+Plasma+Tv/ 
So for an extra R400 you get 11" extra inches but only half the resolution. To me the cheaper of those 2 is actually the better one, not because of the price - I'd still go with the full HD if they were at the same price. And not because of Plasma/LED, to me that's less of a consideration than the resolution.

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wynn (06-Mar-14)

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## Dave A

> I'd go so far as to rent a BlueRay movie for the day when I go to these shops and have them play it for me there - stops them from choosing some special purpose video they coded to look best on a crappy screen.


My tip is make sure there's a low light scene (The Dark Knight, for example). My experience is this is one area where the difference in quality between screen displays becomes really obvious.

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wynn (06-Mar-14)

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## bjsteyn

> I baught a Samsung 46" LED Smart 3D TV. And i am impressed with the quality of picture and features that it pack.
> 
> There are one or two things that arn't perfect. The motion sensing for controlling the TV doesn't work that great, although the voice recognition works almost perfect. Also things like when having to turn up the volume via voice it only increases/descrease by one at a time.
> If my volume is 20 and i want to get it to 50 i have to say "Hi TV, Volume Up, Volumen Up, Volume Up, Volume Up, Volume up, Volume up x 25 more times" I woul like to say "Volume up by 5" or something. Don't know if there is a way mabe to this. But dont see anything in the guide.
> 
> Secondly when trying to connect to media on my server using either Plex or Samsung Link the network connection just breaks at times and every time i add new media to my server is such a mission for the TV to pick up the new media. Also if there is media in folder that the TV doesn't recognize it doesn't want to read the folder. The samsung link web interface for configuring shared folders doesn't work so i had to edit the SQLLite database manually and tried to use Plex as-well, but it also have problems also with the interface and media being read.
> 
> Thirdly, when watching movies form my server directly threw the media player on the TV it has an soap opera effect, and doesn't look like a movie. I am linking my TV to my pc via HDMI, and movies has much more of a movie feel playing it with nero showtime or vlc media player.
> 
> ...


Since i moved my TV to a different room where the lighting is much better, the motion control is working perfect. I also got Plex Media Server to work correctly since i am running it from my desktop pc and not from my laptop anymore.

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