# General Business Category > Technology Forum >  Advice from IT guys

## kavesh

Hi all and happy holidays :Wink: 

My son needs a computer for school next year as his school has decided to go digital. No textbooks and no paper hand written notes.

The school has suggested a device - Mecer Fundi 2-1. can be used as a laptop and tablet. I can get for R4 700., including an active stylus in the box. Only 1 year warranty.

I have found a comparable HP X360 for R4 999. It is an HP so better brand and has a 3 year warranty once registered. No stylus included so will have to buy separately. Active stylus can be quite expensive compared to the passive ones. How much better is the active compared to the passive. The stylus will be required for writing on the screen for taking down notes in class. Can the passive one not do the same. 
Sales people are not trained on products so cannot give me good advice.

Hoping someone on here can advise accordingly.

Thanking you in advance.

Kind regards
Kavesh

----------


## adrianh

There is nothing wrong with Mecer products and there South African support is very good.

----------


## Neville Bailey

The ultimate is an iPad Pro with Apple Pencil - the most realistic digital writing device in my experience.

In my business I use the above combination, and have no need for a printer, paper note pad or pen.

----------


## adrianh

> The ultimate is an iPad Pro with Apple Pencil - the most realistic digital writing device in my experience.
> 
> In my business I use the above combination, and have no need for a printer, paper note pad or pen.


NO - Don't spend a bag of cash on fanboy junk that can't be aftermarket repaired. Apple is a disgusting company that has disgusting business practices.

----------


## ians

> NO - Don't spend a bag of cash on fanboy junk that can't be aftermarket repaired. Apple is a disgusting company that has disgusting business practices.


Cant say i am an apple fan boy...but if i look at the 3 apple devices I own ...an iphone 5 ...iphone 5S and an old ipad mini ...and compare to other brands ...the ones my wife uses ... none of her devices have held up... not even 2 years and she has to replace her huawei phone ...it has a firmware glitch ... they want R500 just to look at it...and she looks after her stuff ...I abuse my apple devices ...fallen off out my pocket at 40 km/hr while cycling... dropped the phone from a ladder etc etc ... after about 5 years i final managed to break the screen... R450 later i had a new screen... my iphone is so old it has already had 2 battery replacement... it has just swollen for the 3 rd time (after market batteries ...not apple) 

I plan to upgrade my ipad... with a new tablet ...would i buy another apple product... hell yes.

----------


## adrianh

> Cant say i am an apple fan boy...but if i look at the 3 apple devices I own ...an iphone 5 ...iphone 5S and an old ipad mini ...and compare to other brands ...the ones my wife uses ... none of her devices have held up... not even 2 years and she has to replace her huawei phone ...it has a firmware glitch ... they want R500 just to look at it...and she looks after her stuff ...I abuse my apple devices ...fallen off out my pocket at 40 km/hr while cycling... dropped the phone from a ladder etc etc ... after about 5 years i final managed to break the screen... R450 later i had a new screen... my iphone is so old it has already had 2 battery replacement... it has just swollen for the 3 rd time (after market batteries ...not apple) 
> 
> I plan to upgrade my ipad... with a new tablet ...would i buy another apple product... hell yes.


I am not getting into this - lets agree to disagree.

----------


## Blurock

> NO - Don't spend a bag of cash on fanboy junk that can't be aftermarket repaired. Apple is a disgusting company that has disgusting business practices.


I'm not much of an Apple fan myself, but I am interested to know why you make this comment. 
I am actively looking for alternatives to Microsoft that comes with most products.

----------


## adrianh

> I'm not much of an Apple fan myself, but I am interested to know why you make this comment. 
> I am actively looking for alternatives to Microsoft that comes with most products.


There are many many reasons - Apple is a truly disgusting company and I would not use their products even if I were to be given their top of the line products free of charge.

I am not going to get into a debate about this - There are thousands of documented instances of them being total pigs.

----------


## Dave A

Given what I've seen among adults on the topic, can you imagine the playground "debates" between the kids about the merits of the different brands and operating systems...

----------


## kavesh

Look I think everyone has their own preferences and yes Apple is more expensive. I had an iPhone for years. In fact my iPhone 4 still works perfectly after all these years and the battery is still good. Can you believe that. Whatsapp is no longer supported on an old IOS, what a bummer! Device still looks like new.

Anyways, back to my dilemma  I am torn about the device choice. My personal choice would have been the HP which has a 3 year warranty. The Mecer equivalent is cheaper and has the active stylus with only 1  year warranty. An active stylus can cost upwards from R1 000. Because the device is for a Grade 10 boy i really do not want to spend more than is necessary. 
The Mecer power cable is so flimsy, it looks like car speaker wires, literally. That won't last. No idea what replacement charging cables cost.

I think I may just get the Mecer reluctantly.

----------


## kavesh

> Given what I've seen among adults on the topic, can you imagine the playground "debates" between the kids about the merits of the different brands and operating systems...


Dave the school tried to dictate to parents on buying just one type of device to avoid the perceived status device, but as you can imagine the school was blasted for dictating, especially so as my personal parent network suggest that they not happy to go digital and some are even leaving the school. Finance department for the first time issued a email reminding parents of the terms notice to witthdraw their child from school. I suspect there may have been several requests to leave for greener pastures.

----------


## IanF

I see a school in Australia has reverted to text books.
https://www.smh.com.au/education/maj...29-p5191r.html

----------


## adrianh

> Given what I've seen among adults on the topic, can you imagine the playground "debates" between the kids about the merits of the different brands and operating systems...


Its absolutely horrendous - Remember that all kids have cellphones. I clearly remember all the nonsense when my two daughters were at school. There was the Apple fan-girls and the plebs - my youngest daughter eventually got the Apple phone that she dreamed of which she kept for less than a year and went back to Huawei. No iTunes, No iCloud, No pay extra for space, no silly cables, no dongles, no special silly nonsense.

Look - Each to his own - I personally have a terrible aversion to them because I despise the way they operate their business and I also despise the fanboy nonsense. They are exactly the same as car companies that refuse the others the right to repair and then charge them 10 000 x for their "OEM" Brembo brake pad packed in their special box. 

Their parts are mostly made by Samsung yet they block all forms of after market repair. They force people to buy new devices by declaring then unrepairable although it has been proved over and over that the devices can easily be repaired. I am happy to show you hundreds of instances where they have/ do screw their customers over. 

I enjoy being able to go to the PC shop and select each component and build exactly what I want. If the screen card fails I buy another and replace it. I dislike the notion that only the OEM can repair or alter the "sealed black box" because I know from experience that once this is the case the OEM makes up whatever nonsense stories they want. I understand that the man in the street doesn't always want to be able to do this but I also feel that if my Samsung screen breaks that I want to be able to select my repair agent. I smashed my Samsung tablet screen about a month ago - my wife is bringing me a new screen from the UK and I will fit it myself when I get a chance - or I can that it to the local cell shop and they can repair it for R1.6k in 45 minutes. I don't have to pay R10k and wait 3 weeks for some idiot OEM to tell me that my device is totally screwed and that I need to buy a new one.

Another thing (Yes I am extremely well versed in the shenanigans of Apple) The entire 5G Huawei nonsense was set up by Apple and Trump. The reason - Huawei is the leader in 5G worldwide and of course there is a shedload of money in it. Apple bought Intel's 5G business which of course now has Carte Blanche to supply the US and all its cronies with 5G gear. (Remember that 5G gear goes far beyond just selling cellphones - it goes to all the underlying switchgear - Apple had to find an alternative market to cellphones because the market is practically saturated with innovation - 5G switchgear is a massive market because there is so much of it due to the range limits - lots of antennae etc)

Anyway - I will never support Apple for many many reasons - they are truly a terrible underhanded business and they know how to hide their underhandedness through fanboy marketing.

Look up:
iPad Rehab
Louis Rossmann
CBC News
and many more on YouTube to see exactly how terrible they are.

Oh, and please don't think that I support Google either - I hate them just as much as I hate Facebook!!!

Huawei MUST bring out an alternative OS so that we can dump Google / Android and their horrendous hold on the man in the street. Give me a basic phone with no tracking and a Garmin GPS - Google doesn't have to know that where I am and what I do at all times. The only way to operate in the digital world is by using fake accounts for 99% of your activities on the net.

I sound like an old fart that is anti technology - I am not - I am anti large companies shoving their advertising and their views down my throat all the time. Thank G...D for serious ad blockers, hosts file level blocking and uBlock Origin.

----------


## kavesh

> I see a school in Australia has reverted to text books.
> https://www.smh.com.au/education/maj...29-p5191r.html


This is what I am afraid of. The kids are going to be ginnea pigs in this process and they will be the ones who suffer the consequences of a bad experiment by the school.

----------


## adrianh

> I see a school in Australia has reverted to text books.
> https://www.smh.com.au/education/maj...29-p5191r.html


IanF - You know - My eldest daughter is doing a BA in English Literature so my house is filled with books (real ones with dog ear pages) 

The problem with textbooks are as follows: 
1. They are very very heavy (my girls used to lug a very very bag around every day)
2. They are expensive
3. The money making buggers revise them every year so as to sell you a new version for no other reason than making money. Math hasn't changed in 100 years yet every year you have to buy a new textbook.

University is even worse - R4,000 for books per year that go to a landfill because the publishers are in cahoots with the education institutions. Varsity College is a case in point - they must make a fortune in kickbacks.

So, is it good to use real books for education - I don't think so - its just a money making racket.

I suppose that I sound like a ranting old lunatic - I just hate the extreme unnecessary waste at our expense caused by institutions for their profit.

----------


## adrianh

> This is what I am afraid of. The kids are going to be ginnea pigs in this process and they will be the ones who suffer the consequences of a bad experiment by the school.


Tablets in schools is nothing new. Many schools do it. Montessori has been doing it for many years.

Tablets will not fix the fact that the kids are taught garbage in school in the first place. The quality of education in this country is terrible - the textbooks are terrible and some of the teachers are terrible too. The beauty of using electronic devices that kids get to take home is that hey an watch tutorials and learn interactively even when thy are at home.

----------


## IanF

> IanF - You know - My eldest daughter is doing a BA in English Literature so my house is filled with books (real ones with dog ear pages) 
> 
> The problem with textbooks are as follows: 
> 1. They are very very heavy (my girls used to lug a very very bag around every day)
> 2. They are expensive
> 3. The money making buggers revise them every year so as to sell you a new version for no other reason than making money. Math hasn't changed in 100 years yet every year you have to buy a new textbook.
> 
> University is even worse - R4,000 for books per year that go to a landfill because the publishers are in cahoots with the education institutions. Varsity College is a case in point - they must make a fortune in kickbacks.
> 
> ...


Adriaan
I hear you and this is not just a problem with books. Look at software most companies are trying to convert us SAAS model. When a programme like Excel won't need updating for 99% of the users. 
But with books when you use one, you concentrate on that instead of the other 20 tabs open on your device. The closest I have seen to a proper book is a kindle but it is hard to dog ear it to the correct page with that one word you don't understand.
I remember copying 1 chapter for my daughter of a text book because they only needed that chapter and the book smelt of a dead animal. So the rest was a waste.

----------


## adrianh

> Adriaan
> I hear you and this is not just a problem with books. Look at software most companies are trying to convert us SAAS model. When a programme like Excel won't need updating for 99% of the users. 
> But with books when you use one, you concentrate on that instead of the other 20 tabs open on your device. The closest I have seen to a proper book is a kindle but it is hard to dog ear it to the correct page with that one word you don't understand.
> I remember copying 1 chapter for my daughter of a text book because they only needed that chapter and the book smelt of a dead animal. So the rest was a waste.


I dunno about this - My daughter works with 2 laptops and 3 screens - she downloads and reads hundreds of books and journals all the time. Having many tabs open when you are studying is not a function of paper vs CRT but rather of ill discipline.

----------


## adrianh

Interesting that I can only reach this website via a VPN Now - Looks like my IP address got blocked....

...oh well... we live and learn....

----------


## Dave A

> Interesting that I can only reach this website via a VPN Now - Looks like my IP address got blocked....


It is extremely unlikely that this is as a result of a setting on TFSA. Try running TRACERT from the command prompt which may help identify where the problem is. 

Alternatively, if you connect via a static IP address, PM me your IP address and I'll look into it.

----------


## adrianh

> It is extremely unlikely that this is as a result of a setting on TFSA. Try running TRACERT from the command prompt which may help identify where the problem is. 
> 
> Alternatively, if you connect via a static IP address, PM me your IP address and I'll look into it.


I think it was a glitch in the matrix. Its all good this morning.

----------


## ians

So i am looking into a paperless 2020 ...a system to bill customs while on site etc etc

I went and had a look at an ipad with a plug in keypad and pencil (rounded figues)

R5000 for the ipad gen 7

R2500 for the pencil

R3500 for the keypad

I think i am gona stick to my R30 pen and R3 brown cover note books for now.

----------


## Kevin Smith

Hi Kavesh

I won't get into the apple debate - no winners on that argument.

Both the active and passive stylus will work taking down notes. Normally an active stylus has an input button that can be set to be used as an eraser or a double click, making his life easier when taking notes.

Incredible Connection (not a marketing plug I promise) have the Fundi 2-1 13.3" online at R4499 including active stylus. They also advertise a 3 year warranty Upon Registration, which you can complete online.

egadgets.co.za - R4450 including delivery

Compare the specs and make your own decision. There is quite a big difference between the Fundi 13.3 " screen and X360 at 11.6" in terms of landscape, and you child staring at it all day. The HP also has 500gig of storage compared to 32 on the Fundi - but the Fundi is emmc, so it will be a lot quicker to access. You may have to add an SD card to the Fundi if you need more space, but that isn't a very expensive exercise. Also try compare battery life between the models - nothing worse than having to be plugged in in every second class just to be able to work  :Smile: 

If you are shopping purely on price - have you had a look at the Galactic Flex?

Both machines have different merits, but you aren't the one working on it all day. Take you child to the local pc shop, give him the 2 options, and let him decide.

----------


## New Perspective studio

> Given what I've seen among adults on the topic, can you imagine the playground "debates" between the kids about the merits of the different brands and operating systems...


Lol at this, Im not for apple either i have had this discussion way way too may times to do it again as for ops question. I had a hp and I put that thing through alot in college and after its had many sips of my morning coffee it was my second HP that lasted like that. I hear alot of bad things about hp especially the support related issues. I think However we just see more of it as its a more present brand. If there were as many acers or mecers or dells out there we would surely also hear alot of complaints. And like you said 3 years warranty, and the cables thing if they cant make an effort to make the outside look like quality imagine what the inside must look like.

----------


## kavesh

Thanks for all the replies guys. We eventually decided on the Mecer Fundi.
I bought the device from SAVE Hyper for R4 699. It was a new spec than the one at incredible connection with 128gb storage. Only 1 year warranty though.
One of the big reasons for going the Mecer route was the active stylus included. Read many articles which suggested that an active stylus is more precise.
Due to the intended purpose of the device I was not keen to spend more than I really needed to.
So far my son is really only using it for Maths. The other subject teachers are not geared up to it it seems. There are other failings at school where the wifi infrastructure appears to be totally inadequate as it has crashed a few times.
My son keeps telling me that he is unable to download any material the teachers have tried to give them. So far I am not a happy parent of this experiment!

----------

Dave A (28-Jan-20)

----------


## adrianh

> Thanks for all the replies guys. We eventually decided on the Mecer Fundi.
> I bought the device from SAVE Hyper for R4 699. It was a new spec than the one at incredible connection with 128gb storage. Only 1 year warranty though.
> One of the big reasons for going the Mecer route was the active stylus included. Read many articles which suggested that an active stylus is more precise.
> Due to the intended purpose of the device I was not keen to spend more than I really needed to.
> So far my son is really only using it for Maths. The other subject teachers are not geared up to it it seems. There are other failings at school where the wifi infrastructure appears to be totally inadequate as it has crashed a few times.
> My son keeps telling me that he is unable to download any material the teachers have tried to give them. So far I am not a happy parent of this experiment!


Don't whine - be part of a solution!!!!!!!! 

Education is a team effort - Both my daughters are doing well at university in spite of the national education system. We taught them to ask for help and find solutions rather than sit back and whine all day.

----------


## Dave A

> So far my son is really only using it for Maths. The other subject teachers are not geared up to it it seems. There are other failings at school where the wifi infrastructure appears to be totally inadequate as it has crashed a few times.
> My son keeps telling me that he is unable to download any material the teachers have tried to give them. So far I am not a happy parent of this experiment!


Any idea as to whether these are teething problems that will improve in the near future, or is this going to be a long process?

----------


## kavesh

> Don't whine - be part of a solution!!!!!!!! 
> 
> Education is a team effort - Both my daughters are doing well at university in spite of the national education system. We taught them to ask for help and find solutions rather than sit back and whine all day.


lol......this may seem like a whine but really it is stating the facts as they are now.
Have you ever met with school teachers? I am generalizing here but most of them will not listen to positive feedback or will not accept assistance. Well that has been my experience.
We are meeting the principal this week to further discuss our concerns. 
So easy to say be part of the solution, will they accept help? that is a another issue!

----------


## kavesh

> Any idea as to whether these are teething problems that will improve in the near future, or is this going to be a long process?


Dave, if you did not bring in experts to assist in setting up your infrastructure and the fact that teh teachers had not been trained on how to use the device as a teaching aid, or the fact that the teachers had no idea at the beginning of the year whether they were going to be given devices to use or have to buy their own, tells me of the preparation for this.
My gut says that this is going to be a long frustrating process.
Thus far the only subject it is being used for is Maths. The school said they were going completely digital in all subjects this year for the entire high school.

----------


## adrianh

> lol......this may seem like a whine but really it is stating the facts as they are now.
> Have you ever met with school teachers? I am generalizing here but most of them will not listen to positive feedback or will not accept assistance. Well that has been my experience.
> We are meeting the principal this week to further discuss our concerns. 
> So easy to say be part of the solution, will they accept help? that is a another issue!


I understand where you are coming from - that said, I am a pragmatic person, If I can't solve a problem in one way then I'll solve it in another way - To me life is about finding solutions (to the real problems) - If the school is crap then work around it in some way - and yes, I will admit that I whine about lots of stuff - I  HATE THE TRAFFIC DEPARTMENT - MORONS!

----------


## Firep1995

> Hi all and happy holidays
> 
> My son needs a computer for school next year as his school has decided to go digital. No textbooks and no paper hand written notes.
> 
> The school has suggested a device - Mecer Fundi 2-1. can be used as a laptop and tablet. I can get for R4 700., including an active stylus in the box. Only 1 year warranty.


if I were you, I'd take a look for Dell or HP laptops-tablets

----------


## kavesh

> if I were you, I'd take a look for Dell or HP laptops-tablets


A bit late for that now!
Anyways the Mecer was sent in for a warranty repair the week of the lockdown. The one hinge is faulty. No repairs have been effected as the supplier is closed. The race to get it back in time for school will be the challenge.

----------


## adrianh

> A bit late for that now!
> Anyways the Mecer was sent in for a warranty repair the week of the lockdown. The one hinge is faulty. No repairs have been effected as the supplier is closed. The race to get it back in time for school will be the challenge.


A tablet with a hinge?

----------


## kavesh

> A tablet with a hinge?


No, the Mecer Fundi is a 2 in 1, laptop and tablet :Smile:

----------


## adrianh

> No, the Mecer Fundi is a 2 in 1, laptop and tablet


That is a notebook not a tablet. Even Mercer refers to it as a notebook.

----------


## kavesh

> That is a notebook not a tablet. Even Mercer refers to it as a notebook.


 :Confused:

----------


## adrianh

> 


I just point it out because you said initially that you were looking to buy a tablet for your kid. Kids will quickly destroy things with hinges.

----------


## kavesh

> I just point it out because you said initially that you were looking to buy a tablet for your kid. Kids will quickly destroy things with hinges.


Please read the first post on this thread adrianh.

Lets just close this here :Cool:

----------

adrianh (14-Apr-20)

----------


## adrianh

Lets hope you get it fixed quickly - the kids are really going to need it when they get back to school.

----------

