# Social Category > General Chat Forum >  Join me in saluting the Goffal Committee of Rhodesia/Zimbabwe.

## ChrisNG53

In Rhodesia Coloured folk included an intriguing sub- group who helped us re-identify ourselves as goffals  Most had nick-names such as MaBeans, Nags, Zanda, Curry, Kalangas, Zozo, Cooler, Junks, Mabena, Dorlans, Stoory, Porgy, Goomie, Fiego ..... "
The fact that there were no Coloured policemen, so the good weed was freely available, contributed to the wonderful diversity of our coummunity.
They were an ad hoc assemblage of free spirited and loquacious social commentators unrelenting in according issues a unique perspective. Goffal" was a reference to a Coloured person; and "honkie" and "haute" to a White and Black person respectively. It was rare to hear the different race groups referred to in any other way. Whatever their origins such references were not considered or meant to be disparaging. It was just the way it was in the discourse culture of our community. 
Whatever one may have thought about this sub-group, what emanated from within it was often chillingly disconcerting. It is said that "facts are awkward things". The committee would serve up a plethora of awkward things with brutal irreverence. 
Why were White folk busy tanning their bodies to achieve a nice shade of brown, and curling their hair, whilst despising Coloured folk? Conversely why were Black folk lightening their skins, and straightening their hair, whilst mouthing slogans about "black power" and "black is beautiful" and "I am black and I am proud"? One day the whole world would be some shade of brown however much racial prejudice there was. The need for inter-racial sex was just too strong. 
To the members of this committee the world seethed with convenient untruths and suppression of inconvenient truths. "You cannot talk about justice " they would say, "  when most people in this country simply cannot afford a good lawyer to defend them  justice is only for the rich". 
And so they went on about a range of issues. If the White man had not come to Africa, the mosquitoes, lions, hyenas and crocodiles would have still had the locals in check. Africa had still not even invented the wheel on arrival of the White man. Zimbabwe was doomed even though the Mugabe cabinet had " more degrees than a thermometer" The Jews were forever cursed for having killed Jesus. Starting a religion was "the best business" and most were about making money. 
White people had decimated all wild life in their own countries and now wanted to "preach conservation" to Blacks. The United Nations was nothing more than an incredibly expensive club for political leaders to peddle power, assets and influence for themselves with little corresponding love of humanity. It should be called the "Disunited Nations" or "The United Corrupt Leaders". 
I was not spared and routinely castigated for being part of a system that was inherently unjust. 
The list was endless. It was irreverent  it was not politically correct  it was brutally impolite  but mostly it raised terribly awkward questions that were very difficult to answer. Facts are indeed awkward things. The committee was a heaving hive of cynicism and skepticism. The disturbing thing however is that its predictions are being proved right with monotonous regularity. 
Zimbabwe has joined other countries in Africa as a failed state. 

The United Nations is a spectacular failure in terms of a cost/benefit test. One needs only to point to the continuing instances of genocide that occur, despite pontifical statements mouthed off at the UN and AU, that was laughed off outright as one of the biggest jokes of our times..
A brown tan and curly hair is  well more desirable then ever  and  by the time Michael Jackson died he had all but rid himself of all his blackness  the list is endless.
Today I salute them because, at the heart of their stance was their insistence that bullshit baffles brains. They insisted that human beings are hotwired to swallow even utter nonsense, hook line and sinker, provided wonderful promises are included.
Curry and company were the first to teach me to see things for what they actually are .... to think more and believe less.
Today the supposedly most advanced people on this planet have been taken in by a narcissistic buffoon who has baffled them with his fancifull promises. 
Our goffal committee would have explained that Trump was a "Skate". A skate was a person who diddled others on the strength of "bullshit".
Today the great USA has fully confirmed that they were 100% right. 
I am predicting that only the scrapping of ObamaCare will be fulfilled of all Trumps bullcrap promises.
PS: Wow ... Trump has already started retracting his loud promises about scrapping ObamaCare.

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## Blurock

I sense some tongue-in-cheek banter here.

I've known the word Goffal or Goffel since my youth, but have refrained from using it as I have perceived it as being offensive. I've also heard people from Indian descent call each other Charro's.

What is the the meaning of these words and where did it originate? Is it not offensive?

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## HR Solutions

It's a derogatory word and doesn't deserve a read or a reply !!!!

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## Blurock

> It's a derogatory word and doesn't deserve a read or a reply !!!!


My view too. That's why I am asking.

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## ChrisNG53

"Goffal" is a term imported by Rhodesian Coloureds from South Africa to reference ourselves as being distinct, politically incorrect, rebellious but still relevant. Humans will often adopt symbols and language around which they will stage and rally.
"Goffal" is considered highly offensive by South African Coloureds.

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## ChrisNG53

Does this TRUE article about these humans have NO relevance or interest????
Is the fact that they have been proved right quite spectacularly NOT of any significance??

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## Dave A

Taking Chris's questions one step further -
Are South Africans too easily offended?

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## HR Solutions

Of course SA's are easily offended but considering the world that we live in and considering that certain things offend people then why go back 40 years and still call them that ! I think it is dumb and shows a lack of ignorance and is plain shit stirring !

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## ChrisNG53

It is so difficult to understand how this true post can be "offensive". 
It happened. 
It was the reality.
This lot contributed their brand of social discourse and thinking to the prevailing culture. 
They had an "irreverent"  stance about all race/ethnic groups,governments and entities such as the United Nations and the African Union. 
So they comprise a small but "real" piece of the fabric that made up Rhodesian society.
This article has been posted to 21 social media sites. 
It has received acclaim and appreciation from hundreds, if not thousands ... because it is deemed as informative, intriguing,  surprising, entertaining,  ..... 
Why anybody should feel offended at being told about the historical conduct of a very small group of humans is truly bemusing. No one has been offended to date.
Why it should be considered "stirring"to reveal another aspect of Rhodesian history is confusing.
From my perceptive I am REALLY intrigued at how right they have been proved over and over again ... and especially now as regards the the USA elections that indeed "bullshit baffles brains" .... lol .. lol .. lol ..  
It should also be noted that as we did not have any Coloured policemen in our community we were free to partake of the good weed,of which Malawi Gold was the favorite of this grouping ... lol ..

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## HR Solutions

Ok I understand where you are coming from now Chris ...... Are you the retired judge that was on our television recently ?

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## Blurock

> Taking Chris's questions one step further -
> Are South Africans too easily offended?


Very often people will unnecessarily make an issue of a small thing just to "prove a point" or to get back at another race group, language group, religious group or whatever. What we have to bear in mind is that it's not really words that hurt, but attitudes. That is why black Americans can call each other "niggers" at times, but when a police officer uses that term, it is offensive. It is because it implicates that the officer is superior to the black guy.

Our history is one of turmoil and war, of victor and conquered, of slaves and masters. Even today you get white Afrikaners who resent the British because of the atrocities (read war crimes) of the Boer war. The black tribes conquered by the Brits and the Boers may feel the same resentment. Descendants of the slaves in the Cape Colony do not want to be reminded of their forefathers' suffering. Therefore any derogatory word that may suggest that a person is of a lower class or lesser breed will be seen as offensive. 

It is therefore essential that we learn more about our different cultures and start respecting each other as people. Treating people with respect breeds mutual trust on which a future can be built. We need to plant the seeds now for our future generations to live prosperous and peaceful lives in this beautiful country.

Not all South Africans have had the same opportunities with regard to education or training, however our resilience has seen many South African sons and daughters rise above poverty and prejudice to become respected entrepreneurs and leaders not only in their communities, but also on the world stage. Let's aspire to rise with them and refrain from pulling each other down instead.

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## AndyD

Not having had the benefit of being raised in SA (I arrived here when I was in my 30's) the words such as 'goffel' or 'haut' probably don't have the same impact on me as other readers, obviously I'm aware of their meanings and even some of their undertones but to me their almost foreign words and they don't invoke any particular emotion.

Even reading it through more cynical eyes I wouldn't take away any malice or racist undertones from the post, quite the opposite in fact, Chris obviously has a place in his heart for this group of people.

When I first read the opening post the thing that struck me first was a certain unease at the glorification and almost delight that was implied at the way a group of grown people who viewed the world through narrow blinkers of inexperience and possibly lack of education asked the types of questions (and in such away) that young children might ask. It reminded me of the way parents glorify or take great delight in their children to other parents/adults when they ask awkward questions that are difficult to answer because of the childs limited base of knowledge on which you could pitch a useful answer. I guess in short I worried it was patronising.

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## ChrisNG53

> Ok I understand where you are coming from now Chris ...... Are you the retired judge that was on our television recently ?


Yes  and as such I have a love of the whole truth, including the whole truth about the rich diversity of this region. 
As a Coloured person this sub-group occupy a special place in my heart and I imagined that their existence would be of interest to members as one more panel in the mosaic making up the humans in this region. 
I also imagined that members would be intrigued at how spectacularly right they have been proved by the supposedly most advanced people on this planet in their insistence that bullsh*t baffles brains.
Why anybody feels offended by this baffles me to the nth degree.

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## ChrisNG53

> Not having had the benefit of being raised in SA (I arrived here when I was in my 30's) the words such as 'goffel' or 'haut' probably don't have the same impact on me as other readers, obviously I'm aware of their meanings and even some of their undertones but to me their almost foreign words and they don't invoke any particular emotion.
> 
> Even reading it through more cynical eyes I wouldn't take away any malice or racist undertones from the post, quite the opposite in fact, Chris obviously has a place in his heart for this group of people.
> 
> When I first read the opening post the thing that struck me first was a certain unease at the glorification and almost delight that was implied at the way a group of grown people who viewed the world through narrow blinkers of inexperience and possibly lack of education asked the types of questions (and in such away) that young children might ask. It reminded me of the way parents glorify or take great delight in their children to other parents/adults when they ask awkward questions that are difficult to answer because of the childs limited base of knowledge on which you could pitch a useful answer. I guess in short I worried it was patronising.


Lol... There is actually no need to try an "over- intellectualize" simple anecdotal recounting of human experience.  Just accept what you are reading and resist imputing imagined motives. The article provides the motive ... i.e, it is intended to inform. amuse, bemuse, intrigue .... as ALL stories about humans are intended to do.

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AndyD (22-Nov-16)

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## ChrisNG53

As to their sense of humour there is the following exchange – 

Me: You know there was this inquest to-day at the court 
Curry: Ya, ou Vavie, tell us who frekked [died]  (Vavie is me)
Me: This guy had crabs ... you know ... pubic lice 
Nags: Naa, crabs don't kill man ... they just tickle ... and itch like mad 
Me: He tried to get rid of the crabs ... with paraffin and stuff ... when that failed he finally rubbed Rogor CE [garden pesticide] onto his testicles ... he was dead in 2 hours 
Cooler: Wow ... doed [dead] in 2 hours ... because of Rogor ... that's heavy man
Me: You see Rogor is an organophosphorus poison, [I add sapientially] it is absorbed through the skin into the blood stream. So when it got to his kidneys and liver - that was it - in just 2 hours …
Mabeans: The haute was dwaarse [slow witted] ... if he was a goffal he would have soaked his balls in brandy ... so the crabs could have had a lekker party. 
Then, when they were high on dop, he would have added river sand ... and the crabs would then have all stoned each other to death ... problem solved [he finishes with a flourish amidst peals of laughter].

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## HR Solutions

I think we have become supersensitive ....... those (myself included) who tries to avoid race issues and hates it when someone starts "stirring" the pot or causing plain kak by creating a racial issue when sometimes there is not ! Yes we should be able to talk and joke about certain things.  My son is at Wits at the mo and has seen the crap that has gone on their and tells us that half of the "protestors" are not actual protesters but those that are causing crap for the sake of it and join the protesters gravy train.  Yes we all know this but that is why the rest of us sometimes becomes oversensitive and tries to avoid things like that at all cost and conversations especially on the internet.  This was my initial thinking of this post.  SA has become a ticking time bomb - it is as if people are just waiting for the opportunity to call the race card.  Why can we not just live in harmony together.  It is clear that this will never happen throughout the world.

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## ChrisNG53

> I think we have become supersensitive ....... those (myself included) who tries to avoid race issues and hates it when someone starts "stirring" the pot or causing plain kak by creating a racial issue when sometimes there is not ! Yes we should be able to talk and joke about certain things.  My son is at Wits at the mo and has seen the crap that has gone on their and tells us that half of the "protestors" are not actual protesters but those that are causing crap for the sake of it and join the protesters gravy train.  Yes we all know this but that is why the rest of us sometimes becomes oversensitive and tries to avoid things like that at all cost and conversations especially on the internet.  This was my initial thinking of this post.  SA has become a ticking time bomb - it is as if people are just waiting for the opportunity to call the race card.  Why can we not just live in harmony together.  It is clear that this will never happen throughout the world.


It is a simple matter of choice. 
The mature open mind has no difficulty in appreciating realities and abstracting that which is good and discarding that which is bad.
Just about everything is made up of good, bad and ugly.
Just take your pick.

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## ChrisNG53

So much time has passed since I first put this up.
During that time the Monte Python type wisdom of the group I adverted to has been more than vindicated, in terms of the surreal state that the USA now finds itself in, being ruled by a leader whose blindingly clear chief attributes are bullcrap and buffoonery. :Wink:

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## vieome

> So much time has passed since I first put this up.
> During that time the Monte Python type wisdom of the group I adverted to has been more than vindicated, in terms of the surreal state that the USA now finds itself in, being ruled by a leader whose blindingly clear chief attributes are bullcrap and buffoonery.


Judge 

Firstly, I get the point you are trying to make. But there are many factors that are vague.  I have noticed that on the one hand you have a vested interest in your attempts to provoke white guilt. I am betting someone like Cooler would say "Sh*t happens." One of the problems you miss, is that although one could argue that there is such a thing as Goffal pride, there are many bad elements connected to the term Goffal and many elements of Goffal people that are bad. 

I would prefer if you looked at the idea, of what it meant to be a goffal, in which a whole sub culture of people, mixed from all nations of the world bonded into one. We had white goffals, black goffals, chinese goffals, indians goffals etc. As Goffals we are nothing more than a footnote in the history of mankind. Yes there is the brown valvet awards and that, but just like we were formed out of British white guilt, we have melted away and blended into what ever exile country we have chosen.  

I have written a book about Goffal life, but do any of these people from the community you want me to salute support. NO they dont because that is part of the Goffal nature. 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1079902937

So I will not join you in saluting them. Ha Sut, goffals are not what they used to be, let me be the one to tune you, if you want elucidate mensir about Goffals, take your story to the Queen, ask Her about the Great British Betrayal of the Goffals, that were left to suffer after Lanchester agreement. Why are they not entitled to British rights, like the white colonizers were. 

You bring your message to the ForumSA, and to the Rhodesian forum, why not go to the source directly. Ask the bloody Queen to Salute the Goffals.

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## ChrisNG53

> Ok I understand where you are coming from now Chris ...... Are you the retired judge that was on our television recently ?


Yes.

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## ChrisNG53

> Judge 
> 
> Firstly, I get the point you are trying to make. But there are many factors that are vague.  I have noticed that on the one hand you have a vested interest in your attempts to provoke white guilt. I am betting someone like Cooler would say "Sh*t happens." One of the problems you miss, is that although one could argue that there is such a thing as Goffal pride, there are many bad elements connected to the term Goffal and many elements of Goffal people that are bad. 
> 
> I would prefer if you looked at the idea, of what it meant to be a goffal, in which a whole sub culture of people, mixed from all nations of the world bonded into one. We had white goffals, black goffals, chinese goffals, indians goffals etc. As Goffals we are nothing more than a footnote in the history of mankind. Yes there is the brown valvet awards and that, but just like we were formed out of British white guilt, we have melted away and blended into what ever exile country we have chosen.  
> 
> I have written a book about Goffal life, but do any of these people from the community you want me to salute support. NO they dont because that is part of the Goffal nature. 
> 
> https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1079902937
> ...


I am glad you say that you "get the point I am trying to make".

Just to remind everyone, it was that this band of irreverent, rebellious, pot-smoking sub-culture leaders have been proved 100% right that _bullshit baffles brains._.
We see it being played out right now in the "Great US of A" and in "Great Britain".

Daily the world is treated to supposedly intelligent upstanding members of the leadership class facing the cameras and brazenly ... shamefacedly ... unashamedly ... lying through the teeth ...
AND ... AND ... AND ... millions of people swallowing this OBVIOUS BULLCRAP hook line and sinker ... including other supposedly intelligent upstanding members of society
That is the point.!!!!

No need to carp about it ... grumble about it ... intellectualise it ... grumble about it ...

*Veritas simplex oratio est.*

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## vieome

Trust me! I am just as Goffal as the next Ouen. My point is that no one on this forum really cares about stuff like this. This is the stuff you should be preaching to Goffals, so that they can reflect on their past and find a way forward. 

When it comes to Mass control, and Manufacturing consent, many *Goffals* will never be able to tell the difference between bullshit that baffles and bullshit of the *van der merwe* variety. It is the nature of power to corrupt men who come into contact with it , and hence they *con* through their teeth to hold on to it. Many on the fringe such as the Goffals were, get to see a different truth. But now the network connects us all, and just like computers minds can be hacked. 

Like you say '*Lets us have the conversation* ' . If I blindly accept the fact that this sub culture discovered that bullshit baffles brains, and should be saluted, is that not the same as accepting, the blinds truths that these so called leaders are peddling. Growing up in the poorest goffal neighbor hood, and being from the poorest family in the that neighbor hood, I have developed my own truths about our community leaders. The thing with truth I find, is that most people will only accept a truth they already agree with. The brain suffers from a confirmation bias. It is only when we challenge our own bias that we can _temet nosce_. 

So here I will introduce you to my second book https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1071472879, but I know you wont *score the item*.

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## ChrisNG53

> Judge 
> 
> Firstly, I get the point you are trying to make. But there are many factors that are vague.  I have noticed that on the one hand you have a vested interest in your attempts to provoke white guilt. I am betting someone like Cooler would say "Sh*t happens." One of the problems you miss, is that although one could argue that there is such a thing as Goffal pride, there are many bad elements connected to the term Goffal and many elements of Goffal people that are bad. 
> 
> I would prefer if you looked at the idea, of what it meant to be a goffal, in which a whole sub culture of people, mixed from all nations of the world bonded into one. We had white goffals, black goffals, chinese goffals, indians goffals etc. As Goffals we are nothing more than a footnote in the history of mankind. Yes there is the brown valvet awards and that, but just like we were formed out of British white guilt, we have melted away and blended into what ever exile country we have chosen.  
> 
> I have written a book about Goffal life, but do any of these people from the community you want me to salute support. NO they dont because that is part of the Goffal nature. 
> 
> https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1079902937
> ...


I don't know what you mean that I have _"vested interest" about White guilt"._
Right there you betray an inability to simply understand, accept and relate to what is no more, no less, a take on a particular group of humans that existed, behaved and believed in their unique way.

Their central stance that _"bullshit baffles brains"_  had no colour-coding. They accurately predicted what would happen under Robert Mugabe & Co and described Bernard Chidzero, our new Finance Minister who spoke better English than most Englishmen, as having _"swallowed a dictionary through his a*se"_ and doomed to fail. And they were right. Our financial state did get worse.

it matters not what you may think of the label _"Goffal"._  Our community adopted it and it is a label we wear with pride. People have a need to take pride in themselves ... not to please other people. It was part of setting our own unique culture that became world renowned as evidenced by this anecdote.
I walked into an electronics shop in Tottenham Court Road and, in our accent, intonation and style said to the owner -_"I want the best ... I want it now ... and I want it for nothing"_
He immediately beamed all over, gave me a hug and said - _"You must be a Goffal from Zimbabwe"._
So he was able to recognise what a unique grouping I was from even though he was dealing with people from all over the world.

So you need to cut out the carping and hangups you have about those who are different and accept difference in human beings ... and give credit where credit is due.
OK??

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## vieome

I am GOFFAL, I am from Zim. Bullshit does baffle, but brilliance can dazzle. 
I am suggesting that you as a community leader, and being someone of high status in our community, who is connected to people in high places, should be using your energy in a different direction. Perhaps leading a battle for compensation for Goffals from the United Kingdom. Take a visit to Arcadia, Sunningdale, Groove, BG, etc and see the squalor that people are living in. The blacks have spare houses we dont even have spare keys for our house. By bringing the Goffals together into a brotherhood, then they will get the credit that is due. 

https://academiccommons.columbia.edu....7916/D8T72QNV 

I am black and I am white, and very proud of that. I embrace my black side, I embrace my white side, and I embrace my Goffal side, thus I am suggesting a better way to promote the idea you have, that is with spreading(TED), is to approach it from a different front. 

Perhaps another book of mine can explain it further https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1086154398. I am not against your idea, or in disagreement with you, I simply pointing it out that there is a better way to spread your idea.  

I know our history, we cant change history, but we can change the present. Before facebook we had Goffal.com and Foggal raps, I created Foggals Raps for the community. My internet time is very limited so I will end here and simply say.

have a nice day!

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## ChrisNG53

> I am GOFFAL, I am from Zim. Bullshit does baffle, but brilliance can dazzle. 
> I am suggesting that you as a community leader, and being someone of high status in our community, who is connected to people in high places, should be using your energy in a different direction. Perhaps leading a battle for compensation for Goffals from the United Kingdom. Take a visit to Arcadia, Sunningdale, Groove, BG, etc and see the squalor that people are living in. The blacks have spare houses we dont even have spare keys for our house. By bringing the Goffals together into a brotherhood, then they will get the credit that is due. 
> 
> https://academiccommons.columbia.edu....7916/D8T72QNV 
> 
> I am black and I am white, and very proud of that. I embrace my black side, I embrace my white side, and I embrace my Goffal side, thus I am suggesting a better way to promote the idea you have, that is with spreading(TED), is to approach it from a different front. 
> 
> Perhaps another book of mine can explain it further https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1086154398. I am not against your idea, or in disagreement with you, I simply pointing it out that there is a better way to spread your idea.  
> 
> ...


Sigh.
Daily I take a stance on issues of social justice across this planet.
Have been doing this since 2009 on social media and my blog post.
Mine is a small voice for truth, reason and justice.
It is being heard as I have the maximum of 5,000 followers on Facebook, with a waiting list of over 1,000 friend requests.
So it is quite unnecessary to start lecturing me on how and what I should be doing.

*I repeat.*
This is a story of interest ... a human interest story ... no more, no less.
It is told in order to contribute to the mosaic that is humanity.
It is quite remarkable in its own right.

It is of primary interest to me because truth has been at the center of my life as a Courtroom practitioner of some note.
We Courtroom practitioners tend to lead society in condemning these people and their subcultures.
However we profess to being committed to the_ "whole truth"._
This is simply part of that _whole truth._ 

So PLEASE cut out the pontificating and just appreciate that people are different ... and there is often goodness in those differences.
OK???

PS: The post received/enjoyed HUGE acclaim on social media.

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## vieome

Truth! I agree 



> *I repeat.*
> This is a story of interest ... a human interest story ... no more, no less.
> It is told in order to contribute to the mosaic that is humanity.
> It is quite remarkable in its own right.




My Point!
1. We on the same side.
2. *02-Jul-17, 11:07 AM* this thread ended.
3. *08-Oct-19, 11:38 AM* I revived the thread to bring attention back to your original words.
4. I respond with a some what opposing view to hold attention. 
5. I agree *bullshit baffles brains*
6. I add to your story with links showing more of the story of you are telling.
7. I say 'It is an honor(your) to connect with you!'
8. I return to point 5 and ask why *bullshit baffles brains*
9. Lastly I suggest using the knowledge of point 8 to show that if the story, was package in a box called "compensation for Goffals" it will reach a much wider audience. 

Just as I have come to appreciate your understanding and application of Law and your status in that arena. 

Allow me to introduce myself to you. I guess you could call me something of a network and technology mach(my barley was a motor mach), a social media analyst, with an understanding of how attention controls the network. I am not on facebook so I can not send you a friend request. 

by vieome
, 24-Aug-12 at 09:27 AM (28267 Views) 

So I brought this thread back to life as a Salute to you, because you are apart of that committee that gives us identity.

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## vieome



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## ChrisNG53

Yes indeed.
I am the Retired Judge who was on the legal panel commentating on the "Oscar Pistorius Trial of The Century".

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## ChrisNG53

Well argued Eminent Counsel !!.
Much appreciated. 
God bless.

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## ChrisNG53

> Truth! I agree 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My Point!
> 1. We on the same side.
> 2. *02-Jul-17, 11:07 AM* this thread ended.
> 3. *08-Oct-19, 11:38 AM* I revived the thread to bring attention back to your original words.
> ...


Well argued Eminent Counsel !!.
Much appreciated.
God bless.

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vieome (14-Oct-19)

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## ChrisNG53

> Ok I understand where you are coming from now Chris ...... Are you the retired judge that was on our television recently ?


Yes I am.

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## ChrisNG53

Let us take just the current situation in the United Kingdom as an example ...
let alone Trump's "photoshoots" with Kim Jon Un supposedly done to make the world "safer" ... ...
and what the hell he is playing at as regards allowing the Kurds to be genocided ...

as regards the United Kingdom the reality is that the people voted "blind", i.e not having a clue what  Brexit ever meant ...
and Theresa May, as Prime Minister, negotiated ... negotiated ... and negotiated ... and then negotiated some more ...

and, for the FIRST TIME the Poms had a pretty clear idea what Brexit actually meant ...

and now Boris "Hulk" Johnson is allegedly "negotiating" ... and negotiating ....

and for the SECOND TIME the Poms have a clearer idea of what Brexit actually means ... 

*but the people are NOT ASKED to now say if this is what they want* ...
*NO ... NO ... NO ... 
the people are treated to bla bla bla bla ... and MORE bla bla bla ... and then some more bla bla bla ...

bullcrap ... bullcrap ... bullcrap ... and MORE BULLCRAP ... 31, i.e, 24/7.

So our friends Curry & Co are proved 100% RIGHT ... that Bullshit Baffles Brains.!!!!!*

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## Dave A

A classic case of confirmation bias...

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## ChrisNG53

> A classic case of confirmation bias...


Ha Ha Ha ....

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## ChrisNG53

> Ok I understand where you are coming from now Chris ...... Are you the retired judge that was on our television recently ?


Yes I am.

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## ChrisNG53

Right now we are witnessing ----

1. the  Brexit saga  playing out in the UK, as an obscene pantomime, in which just about everyone is indulging in _bla bla bla bull bla bull bla bla crap bla bla bla bullcrap_ instead of simply saying --- _"Now that everyone KNOWS what brexit actually means let's have people decide if they still want it or not"._

2. Trump going _bla bla bla bla bull bla bull bla bla crap_ ... as he sells out the Kurds in a saga of diabolical hypocritical shenanigans ... just as he and his Republican mates sold out on the diabolical murder of Kamal Khashoggi.  

The Brits have always been pretty smart folk. The USA is the leading nation on this planet.
But ins both countries bullcrap is now the order of the day with people being "_eaten in the ear"_ and being _"hurt in their brains"_ horizontally and vertically 31 (24/7)

So Curry & Co stand fully vindicated and deserve this salute.

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## vieome

> A classic case of confirmation bias...


 That is exactly what I stated in one of my responses.

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## vieome

> So Curry & Co stand fully vindicated and deserve this salute.


 What were they accused of? 

Are you stating that democracy itself is a sham(Like Zim, who counts the votes wins). They voted for Britexit under the conditions that all votes are carried out, just like we vote for leaders and we never know what they will deliver. 

The real picture that one needs to look at is what is the effect of information traffickers like Mark Zarkerberg, and the marketing of bullsh*t to the minds of the masses. As a thesis statement, bullshit baffles, is very weak, it needs redirection into how it is made possible in the age of the network.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iX8GxLP1FHo

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## ChrisNG53

> What were they accused of? 
> 
> Are you stating that democracy itself is a sham(Like Zim, who counts the votes wins). They voted for Britexit under the conditions that all votes are carried out, just like we vote for leaders and we never know what they will deliver. 
> 
> The real picture that one needs to look at is what is the effect of information traffickers like Mark Zarkerberg, and the marketing of bullsh*t to the minds of the masses. As a thesis statement, bullshit baffles, is very weak, it needs redirection into how it is made possible in the age of the network.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iX8GxLP1FHo


Not at all sure of the point(s) you are making.
So please read the text of the post and revise you comment so that it has clarity.

Certainly Zuckerberg was involved in marketing bullcrap ... no doubt whatsoever. The Russian trolls put out bullcrap, to help Trump, and Zuckerberg spread it around to millions. 

On Facebook I have been banned for describing the Saudi Regime as "murderous swine" ... even though that regime persecuted women, bombed children and indulged in the diabolical murder of Kamal Khashoggi. 
But Zuckerberg, Trump and the Saudis are big mates.

Between this lot we are fed bullcrap ... bullcrap ... bullcrap ... that millions believe ... believe ... believe ... 
and this proves the point being made here that "bullshit baffles brains".

OK?

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## vieome

> Not at all sure of the point(s) you are making.
> OK?


*vindicate
past tense: vindicated; past participle: vindicated

    clear (someone) of blame or suspicion.* Hence my question? What were they accused of?


*ChrisNG53 "This committee taught you to think more, believe less"*, my point(opinion) is that the reality, is this sub culture, really was stating we should, question our beliefs more, so that we can decipher truth from lies. Hence it is not enough to state what bullshit does, but the committee invites us, to see how and why bullsh*t does what it does. Thus we free ourselves from bullsh*t having its intended effect on our brains. 



Is that not the principle of the founding fathers of our culture, that I should in fact also question the story you are telling? Not to say that I am in disagreement with you, but rather trying to get to the heart and soul of the matter. 

When the network was first built a sub culture emerge that was no different from the committee you talk about. 

*This is an Extract from one of that sub network culture.

4. Freedom is good.

Hackers are naturally anti-authoritarian. Anyone who can give you orders can stop you from solving whatever problem you're being fascinated by  and, given the way authoritarian minds work, will generally find some appallingly stupid reason to do so. So the authoritarian attitude has to be fought wherever you find it, lest it smother you and other hackers.

(This isn't the same as fighting all authority. Children need to be guided and criminals restrained. A hacker may agree to accept some kinds of authority in order to get something he wants more than the time he spends following orders. But that's a limited, conscious bargain; the kind of personal surrender authoritarians want is not on offer.)

Authoritarians thrive on censorship and secrecy. And they distrust voluntary cooperation and information-sharing  they only like cooperation that they control. So to behave like a hacker, you have to develop an instinctive hostility to censorship, secrecy, and the use of force or deception to compel responsible adults. And you have to be willing to act on that belief.*

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## ChrisNG53

> Yes.


Yes I am.

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