Bad attitude

[bones]

Bones - it is very difficult reading some of your posts sometimes without fullstops and capital letters .........

yea my tablet is not so wonderful
so i try to keep things to the point
sorry about that figure where all the
punctuation things hide and try
to use them

[HR Solutions]

Bones - it is very difficult reading some of your posts sometimes without fullstops and capital letters .........

[bones]

I apologise if that statement offended you. It was offered tongue in check, as I was convinced the tone of you bottom line was.

i do come across as a first class
prick but that is because like
you i had to make choices all
is cool i also am a prick and
sorry for that but thanks for
sticking around you can do a
lot of good here

[Entropy Group]

I apologise if that statement offended you. It was offered tongue in check, as I was convinced the tone of you bottom line was.

[bones]

Because of I have a allergic reaction to unemployment and hunger...

it is called doing the right thing but people
dont do that anymore because they are
afraid and i get it

but now knowing what you know would
you say unions act to harshly or is there
actions justified at times not all the time
but sometimes

in my opinion bad employers gets away
with really bad stuff and good employers
get to pay the price

so what do you do bite the bullet or help
bad people to get away with stuff that is
the choice and because of it negotiations
broke down

[adrianh]

Because of I have a allergic reaction to unemployment and hunger...

Good one!

[Justloadit]

There is no logical thought processes when labour and the unions are involved.
It is always one sided towards the employees.
This was great when large parts of the population were employed by the large corporates, but unions and labour have made sure that they were able to cripple the corporates. This in turn has led to employee shedding, or voluntary retirement, or simply retrenchment.

The large base of employees working for corporates have reduced dramatically, and now are looking for work at the smaller industries, and they are trying to create the same havoc. The main problem here is that the numbers are small, so going on strike simply means they are out of employment very quickly.

The only ones with large amount of employees are government and parastatals, but they are also now feeling the pinch, because there is no money for the excess and wastage anymore.

Soon they will be on the streets looking for employment, or start their own businesses and get the same medicine they handed out, which is no longer palatable when they have to pay from their own pocket.

[Hannes Botha]

secondly if you saw an assault on a
worker why didnt you report it to
the ccma or even the police

Because of I have a allergic reaction to unemployment and hunger...

Sorry, I might be just about to be stoned...but I think it's because of all these rights that we are sitting where we are right now. It's so hard to fire somebody because of rights, and because it's so difficult, people don't go the extra mile to prove they want a job. They do what is required and no more, and if they can do less and get paid more by striking, even better....it is evident by the fact that we have no loadshedding anymore, due to companies closing down. Cape Town Rag trade has just about died thanks to Unions demanding more and more money. So now it is cheaper to import from China, where the jobmarket is such that they sleep next to their workstation...and our people sleep on the streets...

This is all great unless Nene gets fired and the economy crumbles...we buy in Rands not Dollars...but we buy raw material in dollars...so all prices go up...

So which are the worst of these two evils: Paying three guys R10/hour and feeding three families or paying one guy R30/hour and letting two families go hungry?

[adrianh]

I will never employ staff on a permanent basis again. The best was is to work with people as fixed term contractors or via labour brokers. The LRA has made it near impossible to get rid of bad staff. Although the LRA tries to protect the employees rights it does so to the detriment of the employer.

It is mind boggling how staff f*ck businesses up. A friend of mine has a ventilation company that manufactures and installs ducting systems. They kept on having problems with cost of materials per job, especially aluminum profiles. He put cameras in the workshop and soon saw what was happening. The f*ckers would pick twice as many profiles as they need. They would then chop the excess profiles up into short sections and carry them off in their rucksacks. The profiles are then sold for scrap metal.

He now has a cameras all over his premises and he offers substantial rewards for whistle-blowers.

[bones]

First and second warnings I give myself. As soon as it becomes dismiss-able, I contact the RMI. In other words serious misconduct, or after a final written warning.

Re: Labour brokers: It has got it's advantages with regards to leave issues, seasonal business, or if you simply don't like a guy, have him replaced. Before I had worked at a plastic plant. National group with about 30 factories. One of the directors was having a bad day, so when one of the guys messed up, he walked up to him, grabbed him (and I mean dug his nails into) his cheeks and headbutted him. On his way out the plant he said to the Labour broker "If you want to keep your business, you make this go away"

removing the rights of the people is
in bad taste and must not be done
however a coin has 2 sides

secondly if you saw an assault on a
worker why didnt you report it to
the ccma or even the police

but you know it is not easy to do
that so dont attack people all of
us have stories like this all of us
are trying to do the right thing
there is no need for attitude

[bones]

"seek professional help with anything and everything never take advice from me" your most valuable statement yet.

since you wish to attack me so openly
you need to also understand that other
people are not in the mood to fight or
have fights with you it is not about win
or lose it is about being professional so
you can make a choice today

if you dislike the idea of outsourcing
then dont bully people into a corner

[Hannes Botha]

First and second warnings I give myself. As soon as it becomes dismiss-able, I contact the RMI. In other words serious misconduct, or after a final written warning.

Re: Labour brokers: It has got it's advantages with regards to leave issues, seasonal business, or if you simply don't like a guy, have him replaced. Before I had worked at a plastic plant. National group with about 30 factories. One of the directors was having a bad day, so when one of the guys messed up, he walked up to him, grabbed him (and I mean dug his nails into) his cheeks and headbutted him. On his way out the plant he said to the Labour broker "If you want to keep your business, you make this go away"

[Entropy Group]

"seek professional help with anything and everything never take advice from me" your most valuable statement yet.

[bones]

Doesn't matter whether they are permanent or not. The Labour Relations Act was recently amended to regulate non-permanent employees (including workers contracted via a labour broker).

i actually know the labor relations act well
enough and yes amendments where made a
few of them

outsourcing Labor is the way to go then i
would do that because in the end labor
relations and disputes are no longer a
problem so i would think twice before
cornering people to much i would work
on a month to month base and get new
people in every month

it will be a pain in he behind but what
else cane you do

[Justloadit]

Yes, but when a contract is over you cancel cancel the labour brokers staff. You can the r hire for a new "contract" period.

Not so easy, if the contract period exceeds 3 months, then they are automatically permanent, and require that you then retrench, with all the things that go with it.

If you make the contract period less, you can extend the contract, but if the period of employment is greater than 3 months, then retrenchment.

Many loop holes have been closed by the LRA.

If you trade in a specific industry, you are obliged by law to join the specific department. Eg if you use copper and lead, then you are required to join the Metals Industry Benefit Fund - MIBFA, if it is automotive, then you need to join Motor industry benefit fund - MIGFA, and abide by their rules.Etc