Open wiring or exposed connections ?

[Derlyn]

Maybe someone can explain the following.

You do an inspection on a house where the lights circuits are wired with open PVC wiring with porcelain cleats in the attic. It's not double insulated wire. It's in good condition and passes all the tests. I give it a pass, however, I must fail the installation because of 1 inch of open wire at a gu downlight connection.

I cannot blame the client for thinking that I'm an idiot.

My question is. What's the difference between the open wiring supported by porcelain cleats and the 1 inch of open wiring at the downlight ?

[Dylboy]

I agree and you made me think of that as well and I can not as yet fault it. Also open wiring is not recommended only.

Keen to see what the others say but I'm with you in this as well.

Also is a ladder considered a tool ?

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[Dave A]

Maybe someone can explain the following.

You do an inspection on a house where the lights circuits are wired with open PVC wiring with porcelain cleats in the attic. It's not double insulated wire. It's in good condition and passes all the tests. I give it a pass, however, I must fail the installation because of 1 inch of open wire at a gu downlight connection.

I cannot blame the client for thinking that I'm an idiot.

My question is. What's the difference between the open wiring supported by porcelain cleats and the 1 inch of open wiring at the downlight ?

Are you allowed to install open PVC wiring with porcelain cleats in the attic as part of a new installation?

[Derlyn]

No. I'm referring to existing installations

[GCE]

Are you allowed to install open PVC wiring with porcelain cleats in the attic as part of a new installation?

I would say Yes
I would not do so or recommend that it be done as such but SANS 10142-1 makes mention of it - I have no idea why it does not say only if installed prior to 1980 or some such time as it was last allowed


6.4.5 Open wiring
NOTE Open wiring consists of single-core insulated conductors that operate at not
more than 250 V to earth; however, this is not a recommended installation method for
new installations.
6.4.5.1 Open wiring shall not be installed
a) under thatched or wood-shingle roofs,
b) in parts of a roof space where the working height is less than 750 mm,
c) in roof spaces that are intended to be used (or are used) for storage, unless
the wiring is suitably protected against mechanical damage,
d) within 1 m of a trap door unless the wiring is suitably protected
against mechanical damage, or
e) where it will be in contact with flammable material.

[Dylboy]

In that case seeing the cores of the FTE in a downlight I then deem ok, as long as not in thatch and those mentioned above.

It's how I have justified it before

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[Dylboy]

However the 750mm thing for angled roofs means a lot of it needs to be protected, is double insulation of the FTE considered suitable mechanical protection ?

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[Isetech]

So we agree the short piece between the FTE and the down light terminal is not a code violation?



The only reason I would think it would be a fail, because the clamp is compressed on the single insulation.

[Dylboy]

I think it's fine, if it is considered open wiring however then if the roof to ceiling is less than 750mm then it needs mechanical protection.

However the FTE pvc is not for mechanical protection so then it does not matter how we do the termination.

So yes I think it is fine and will sign off of that.

Unless it states that the single core PVC from FTE can not be shown then I will continue to do it.

My only reasoning is that the second layer of the FTE is not for mechanical protection...

Second to all this... Earthing of the downlight holder... The mechanism is cumbersome so been thinking can you just take a lead with a croc clip both ends and just clamp it ? I.e from the earth cable to the metal clip...

It's not relying on twisting as the mechanical force of spring is there... It's shoddy but I can't fault this idea yet unless somwhere can say this idea is stupid with a reg hahahah.



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[Derlyn]

I think the answer is to use 1mm FTE where possible and to rather use a 3 way box when looping so that there's always only a single FTE to each GU10 fitting.

Been playing around and making a connection with single FTE is quite doable however it becomes a challenge to get it done correctly with 2 FTE's hence the suggestion of a 3 way box.

[GCE]

I think the answer is to use 1mm FTE where possible and to rather use a 3 way box when looping so that there's always only a single FTE to each GU10 fitting.

Been playing around and making a connection with single FTE is quite doable however it becomes a challenge to get it done correctly with 2 FTE's hence the suggestion of a 3 way box.

Or use a 5 amp socket

[Dylboy]

I like those ideas, my thing is I want to avoid being in the roof as much as possible haha. It's a heat and health risk. So I like to run the loops quickly and then work from the ground with a ladder.

Thinking of doing a join system in a small box that can fit in a downlight hole.

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