"Old" Samite mount options?

[markv]

Hi there,

I have a DB with the very old breaker mounting style. I'll call it "old Samite", but someone please tell me the actual name/term.

Modern samite breakers fit onto the mounts just fine, but the older breakers were two modules wide compared to mini rail breakers. So if one clips on a 1P breaker, you're left with a gap either side.
Two and three module width breakers are fine, as you'll see in my photo below with a 1P+N between two old style isolators.

I'd like to fit some new 20A breakers to replace the old 20A breakers which are starting to fail, but I obviously can't have loads of gaps between breakers. The obvious answer is to use a 1P+N, which isn't great for multiple plug breakers.

Would it be legal to use 2P 20A breakers, and push the jointing pin out between the two poles to create "1P+1P"? The issue I see with this is that one pole will have the information printed on it, but the other won't. My current plug breakers use this "1P+1P" arrangement, but they were intended for this purpose.

Or is there even a way to retrifit mini-rail mounts? I guess I could buy that mini-rail mounting strip and rivet it in place. Bit of a faff though all things considered.

Please excuse the messy wiring, it's all going to be cleaned up as part of the board rejuvination.

[AndyD]

I'd like to fit some new 20A breakers to replace the old 20A breakers which are starting to fail, but I obviously can't have loads of gaps between breakers. The obvious answer is to use a 1P+N, which isn't great for multiple plug breakers.

I would just replace the entire DB with a din rail type. New breakers are different widths as you've discoverd and often they don't line up with the slot in the DB lid so they're always problems. Also busbars don't line up because of the different form factors.

Would it be legal to use 2P 20A breakers, and push the jointing pin out between the two poles to create "1P+1P"? The issue I see with this is that one pole will have the information printed on it, but the other won't.

Absolutely definitely not. An SP+N breaker only has overload protection on one of its poles so you would have one of the circuits with no overload protection.

Or is there even a way to retrifit mini-rail mounts? I guess I could buy that mini-rail mounting strip and rivet it in place. Bit of a faff though all things considered.

Yes, you can retrofit the existing DB enclosure with Samite rail or DIN rail. Getting the rail correctly positioned in all 3 dimensions so the breakers line up with the cutout in the DB lid and also protrude through it can be a bit tricky. At least with this option you just go through the pain once and not every tim in future when you replace a breaker.

[Derlyn]

Nothing wrong with having spaces between the breakers. That's what DB blanks are made for ...... To fill in the gaps.
As long as your labelling is correct, you're ready to go.

[markv]

Hi gents,

Thanks for your replies.
I've since found that I can just get Fuchs adapters which will mount a piece of mini rail. It's pretty cheap and I'm good to go!

[markv]

Oh, and AndyD, I wasn't suggesting 1P+N, I was suggesting 2P. As in 2 white levers.
But I think this wouldn't be legal since the one lever won't have ratings on it.

Interesting how later in years they brought out "1P + 1P" 20A Fuchs breakers, as I have in my DB. Must have been a bridging technology before 13mm mini rail became the new standard.

[Dylboy]

Was it Fuchs or Hymag that started the massive breaker ? I always called it the Hymag to samite adaptor but maybe it was Fuchs.

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[markv]

I believe it's Fuchs, since that's what the CBI accessories catalogue calls it.
I did find photos of the Heineman rail conversion clip, but this was different to Fuchs. Similar though.
Well that's what it all seems like anyway.

[Dylboy]

Ahhh intresting ! Forgot about Heinman haha. Going to Google and then ask supplier to see if their more adaptors and it might explain why some work better than others even though they look the same.



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