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OK, sparky came back today to connect the new RCD in parallel, but this was a miserable failure as he could not get it right and ended up with everything tripping. We are now back where we started with a new RCD that doesnt do anything?
Anyone know of an electrician who knows what they are doing??
I love a good fault that you can get your teeth into but unfortunately I'm flying out again on Monday and won't have time to commit to this type of problem before I go. I'll pop into the forum while I'm away as time permits so if you don't get sorted out in the next 2 weeks you're welcome to send me a pm and I'll schedule a visit when I return.
I love a good fault that you can get your teeth into but unfortunately I'm flying out again on Monday and won't have time to commit to this type of problem before I go. I'll pop into the forum while I'm away as time permits so if you don't get sorted out in the next 2 weeks you're welcome to send me a pm and I'll schedule a visit when I return.
Good luck.
Many thanks for the kind offer! Still feeling a bit shell-shocked after this mornings "re-wiring" of the RCD exercise - in the process with the multiple on/offs I now seem to have two UPS units that don't work anymore!
After three or four sparkies on the same problem, with no progress other than outwardly through my bank account, I am amazed at just how incapable these guys have been at even reasonably logical (scientific) fault finding. This is very worrying as it does not say much for the quality of training. They all tell stories about how many times they have been blown off their ladders (equally worrying) but anything beyond basic wiring up of a new installation appears to be beyond them.
There's no doubt fault finding is the real test of a sparky's understanding of their trade - and nuisance tripping can be a real hunt for the proverbial needle in a haystack (or a pile of needles as Andy points out).
Struggling to nail down the cause of the problem first time around is kinda understandable and forgivable - being unable to separate that outbuilding circuit and get it off the main house earth leakage unit is less easy to accept.
cbi...heineman...same company...the older earth elage units where the better ones...the new ones...seem to be a lot more "sensitive" to voltage fluctuations etc...or so i am told by the experts...but if the earth leakage is really old and has been causing endless tripping problem...it "could be a place to start...
having 2 earth leakage units in series is just unpracticle...the ony reason you fit one in an outbuilding...so that the person in the outbuilding doesnt have to keep going into the house to reset it...so you isolate the outbuilding from the main house..etc
the older type light fittings like the 8 ft double with the big ballast have caused many a headache for me in the past...especially in factories where we have multiple rows of lights...the newer 5 ft and electronic ballast units dont seem to affect the earth leakage unit as much...but then in saying that i dont connect light fittings to an earth leakage unit...and the fatories which i service...i remove the light circuits from the earth leakage...if they create an issue.
dave the sound of it is bad...but in theory only 15 amp plug sockets and a few other items as per sabs regulations are required to be on earth leakage...maybe they should try an insulation resistance tester "megger" before blowing them selves up... dont ever try that if you work near RBM or any of those big companies in richards bay...the DOL are like lice in that place
After three or four sparkies on the same problem, with no progress other than outwardly through my bank account, I am amazed at just how incapable these guys have been at even reasonably logical (scientific) fault finding. This is very worrying as it does not say much for the quality of training. They all tell stories about how many times they have been blown off their ladders (equally worrying) but anything beyond basic wiring up of a new installation appears to be beyond them.
and what is even more scary is when you work on industrial sites where these so called qualified sparkies work...in close proximity...i get nervous...and when you get called out to repair something they break while working..then tell the customer that it must be something i did...well then i just dont play nicely anymore...in fact the last incident...i had set up a meeting with the site engineers and the other company owner...the owner went to site an hour before the meeting and realised that it was in fact his electricians fault...and in fact it was a 5 pin plug and not a 4 pin plug...he was too embarressed to attend the meeting...instead rather got someone else to call and apologise...but here is the joke he is still the prefered contractor on site...regardless of the fact that his staff have been sited for numerous safety violation...need i say more...
maybe they should try an insulation resistance tester "megger" before blowing them selves up...
They do
And it's not that big a blow for crying out loud. Technically it isn't even a contravention of regs as long as the plugs are on earth leakage (and earthing, isolators etc. are all where they should be).
Certainly out of the question on heavy current stuff - but then in those situations nuisance earth leakage tripping doesn't normally come into play anyway.
I don't know how many times it's been the geyser after being left off for a few weeks that's been the culprit.
And stove plates at coastal holiday flats! Don't get me started on those...
It sounds like something along the lines of Andy's post 15 is looking more and more likely. You've got something (or an accumulation of things) which is producing a steady drip of current to earth and it just takes the smallest of capacitance take-up to push the earth leakage unit to trip.
Does your electrician own an earth leakage tester?
This would help in checking at what current the ELCB trips at, with loads connected and with out loads connected
Victor - Knowledge is a blessing or a curse, your current circumstances make you decide! Solar pumping, Solar Geyser & Solar Security lighting solutions - www.microsolve.co.za
I have been caught out by earth leakage units on many occasions, the trickiest was a missplaced neutral do yourself a favour and have the neutrals cheched. All circuits on E.L.U. must have the neutrals going through the E.L.U. as well.Also had many multiplug faults. But the majority have been neutral faults,
Regards
Mike
Now that says a lot. The fact that the kitchen lights are not supplied from the ELCB yet still cause it to trip can only mean a stolen neutral. You need to disconnect all the neutrals and switch everything on, then 1 by 1 reconnect the neutrals. The guilty circuit is bound to be given away by the ELCB. Not quite sure if I understand correctly but if the garage lights are tripping in the house it could mean that there are 2 circuits to the garage. The "original" garage light & plug circuit which was possibly "replaced/upgraded" with a heavier circuit & sub DB, where the sparky never disconnected the "original" "mixed" circuit. Subsequently there could have been extensions done with the wrong neutral.
What are the chances of you posting photos of the insides of the 2 DB's?
Last edited by Sparks; 07-Jan-12, 09:24 PM.
Reason: Request
Now that says a lot. The fact that the kitchen lights are not supplied from the ELCB yet still cause it to trip can only mean a stolen neutral. You need to disconnect all the neutrals and switch everything on, then 1 by 1 reconnect the neutrals. The guilty circuit is bound to be given away by the ELCB. Not quite sure if I understand correctly but if the garage lights are tripping in the house it could mean that there are 2 circuits to the garage. The "original" garage light & plug circuit which was possibly "replaced/upgraded" with a heavier circuit & sub DB, where the sparky never disconnected the "original" "mixed" circuit. Subsequently there could have been extensions done with the wrong neutral.
What are the chances of you posting photos of the insides of the 2 DB's?
Would you please explain what this stolen neutral issue is please? All the sparkles I have had here have solemnly stated that this could be the problem, but have not been able to do anything about it.
I will take some pictures. I had intended to yesterday but when the sparky got into a panic when he found he did not know how to desire the outbuildings from the house el, and everything started tripping (two ups units got fried during the many off and one) I did not get around to it.
Still no recommendation for a good cape town electrician? Maybe there arn't any?
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