White males still dominate top positions in SA

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • E-Deposit
    Email problem
    • Jul 2010
    • 8

    #1

    [Article] White males still dominate top positions in SA

    White males continue to dominate positions in senior and top management. This is 10 years after the Commission for Employment Equity (CEE) was set up to look into transformation trends in the workplace.

    White people account for 62.3% of senior and top management, while blacks account for only 20%. The CEE says there is a need for better representation of the country's demographics in the workplace. Government says the time for begging companies to come to the party is over. It is now pushing for an amended Employment Equity Act that will have bite as the current legislation does not.

    Labour Minister Membathisi Mdladlana says some firms do not take transformation in the workplace seriously. Cabinet is now pondering over the amendments and the minister says it is now time to go for the jugular. Significant percentage fines on company turnover for non-compliance are on the cards.

    "We want to shorten the process around fining people who do not comply with the law. We are sick and tired with the way people delay complying with Employment Equity, giving them 60 days and undertakings. We just want to fine people on the spot just like traffic officers do," says Mdladlana.

    Recommended amendments

    The CEE recommends that amendments that should be made to the Act includes improving monitoring, compliance and increase fines. It also suggests that firms should have Employment Equity Certificates when their Black Economic Empowerment scorecard is being considered by government in tender processes. It argues that the industry's claim that there is a lack of black skill is a fallacy.

    Feedback from industry suggests that 60% of their professionally qualified staff are black, but that is not reflected in training and promotion levels. "We are very concerned that 10 years later or even 16 years after democracy we are still complaining about the lack of transformation in the work place. We are convinced that it is because of resistance as well as racist practices in the work place that make employment equity a difficult thing in the eyes of the employer," says acting CEE chairperson, Mpho Nkeli.

    The CEE also found that wage disparities continued on the basis of race, with white people earning more than their black counterparts doing the same job.

    TOP STORIES LATEST NEWS LIVE BLOG LATEST NEWS MUST WATCH SOUTH AFRICA WEATHER Beaufort WestBethlehemBloemfonteinBloemhofCape TownDe AarDurbanEast
  • adrianh
    Diamond Member

    • Mar 2010
    • 6328

    #2
    Yes I agree, women and blacks are incapable of working their way to the top, we must put them up there so that we all have somebody to laugh at.

    Comment

    • garthu
      Gold Member

      • Dec 2008
      • 595

      #3
      with white people earning more than their black counterparts doing the same job.
      Politicians as usual speaking when they should keep there mouths shut as far as i am concerned. I'm sure we could name a few high earners that achieve absolutely NOTHING.

      I know the past has had impact, it has created separation but i wish everyone would get off there high horse over this and just allow it to be the right person for the job. I reckon most people are over the black/white issues, what people really want is individuals that can do there jobs - simple. Really don't care black or white, just do the job properly. If the the job is done correctly, no one cares.

      If a company is run successfully by a white guy - so what, why change a working formula, if he screws up, black or white, get rid of him.

      This will probably get me slated severely but the the whole BEE issue has quite simply become reverse racism and worse still people actually get rewarded for doing a cuck job.

      I have an immense amount of respect for any individual that can successfully run a company in black or white, very little for a person black or white that is just put there.

      Significant percentage fines on company turnover for non-compliance are on the cards.
      Why mess with it if it's right! Maybe i'm just skipping the point...
      Last edited by garthu; 31-Jul-10, 11:38 AM.
      Garth

      Electric fence Installation : www.midrand-electronics.co.za
      Free Classified Adds : www.bgone.co.za

      Comment

      • murdock
        Suspended

        • Oct 2007
        • 2346

        #4
        when is this country gona move forward?

        there are 2 problem which require urgent attention

        crime too much of it

        skin colour...we need to move on and as i has said before...only when we are all classified as south africans will the race issue move forward and until such time the black people of this country will continue to discriminate against the white minority.

        the other problem this country is experiencing...as the blacks are taking over municipalities so the state of the roads...electricity...water etc are begining to fall apart...becoming a third world country like the rest of africa...it is sad but it is a fact.

        the other joke about the race issue...the youth of this country are the worse raciest...i find the older generation who actually suffered from the apartheid goverment are not the raciest...and people who actually suffered like nelson mandela you never hear a bad word...unless i am missing something this is how i see it.

        another issue which i have mentioned...all the so called "rubbish" they were drumming into us during our national service...like they are going to rape your wife and daughter if you dont do your national service....etc etc...was it rubbish? i read about it everyday in the newspaper.

        78 year old man beaten to death in his workshop...
        young girls gang raped by group while boyfriends are forced to watch...
        husband held at gun point while each gang member rapes his wife and young daughter repeatedly...as he listening to them crying for help...
        etc etc

        hello maybe i am living in a different country to those who mention there is no crime in SA...maybe its time to move to one of these places in
        SA where there is not crime.

        my sister told me there is no crime in PE?
        Last edited by murdock; 31-Jul-10, 12:05 PM.

        Comment

        • adrianh
          Diamond Member

          • Mar 2010
          • 6328

          #5
          Tokio Sexwale & Maria Ramos sure as hell didn't need to be put into the positions that they attained. They got up there all by themselves.

          What amazes me is that people have to be removed from existing positions to be replaced with BEE's rather than the BEE's creating new business for themselves.

          If the tokens were so clever why don't they simply start their own businesses and show the rest of us how it should be done.

          I do not believe that anybody in this country has a problem with working for, or with, women & blacks, we have a poblem with the forced placement of inexperienced people at the expense of existing experienced people.

          Now here's a thought: The government believes that the BEE's will never attain positions of power based purely on merit and that it needs to hold their little hands while they scamper up the corporate ladder, only to teeter at the top before they fall off and land on their butts.

          Comment

          • E-Deposit
            Email problem
            • Jul 2010
            • 8

            #6
            Disagree!

            Originally posted by adrianh
            Yes I agree, women and blacks are incapable of working their way to the top, we must put them up there so that we all have somebody to laugh at.
            I totally disagree with your comment. I'm an independent woman who is determined to be successful!!! How can you look down on us women like that. Not Funny!

            Comment

            • E-Deposit
              Email problem
              • Jul 2010
              • 8

              #7
              Originally posted by murdock
              when is this country gona move forward?

              there are 2 problem which require urgent attention

              crime too much of it

              skin colour...we need to move on and as i has said before...only when we are all classified as south africans will the race issue move forward and until such time the black people of this country will continue to discriminate against the white minority.

              the other problem this country is experiencing...as the blacks are taking over municipalities so the state of the roads...electricity...water etc are begining to fall apart...becoming a third world country like the rest of africa...it is sad but it is a fact.

              the other joke about the race issue...the youth of this country are the worse raciest...i find the older generation who actually suffered from the apartheid goverment are not the raciest...and people who actually suffered like nelson mandela you never hear a bad word...unless i am missing something this is how i see it.

              another issue which i have mentioned...all the so called "rubbish" they were drumming into us during our national service...like they are going to rape your wife and daughter if you dont do your national service....etc etc...was it rubbish? i read about it everyday in the newspaper.

              78 year old man beaten to death in his workshop...
              young girls gang raped by group while boyfriends are forced to watch...
              husband held at gun point while each gang member rapes his wife and young daughter repeatedly...as he listening to them crying for help...
              etc etc

              hello maybe i am living in a different country to those who mention there is no crime in SA...maybe its time to move to one of these places in
              SA where there is not crime.

              my sister told me there is no crime in PE?
              True what you say. Crime is everywhere. People relocate from JHB to Jeffreys Bay to get away from the crime etc however when I stayed in Jeffreys Bay I got mugged/robbed.

              People should stop running away from the problems in this country & stand up as a country & face the problem & do something about it!!! But we can only effectively do something about it if & when we all stand together & take action!

              PS. Ations speak louder than words

              Comment

              • adrianh
                Diamond Member

                • Mar 2010
                • 6328

                #8
                I totally disagree with your comment. I'm an independent woman who is determined to be successful!!! How can you look down on us women like that. Not Funny!

                I will back you 100% in your quest to reach the top yourself, but if you are placed at the top because of BEE then you are on your own.

                You look down on yourselves if you force companies to put you in token positions of power.

                Comment

                • Joblife.co.za
                  New Member
                  • Jul 2010
                  • 3

                  #9
                  Originally posted by adrianh
                  Yes I agree, women and blacks are incapable of working their way to the top, we must put them up there so that we all have somebody to laugh at.
                  I totally disagree with that comment. I can't even believe you said it. I do hope you were only joking and even so it would have been a joke of bad taste.

                  Also adding to that I feel that it is bad practice to enforce something that allows people to be placed in high positions as figure heads. This does not benefit anyone and in fact makes matters even worse.
                  Adrianh one thing I do agree with you on is "I will back you 100% in your quest to reach the top yourself, but if you are placed at the top because of BEE then you are on your own."

                  Comment

                  • adrianh
                    Diamond Member

                    • Mar 2010
                    • 6328

                    #10
                    Yes I agree, women and blacks are incapable of working their way to the top, we must put them up there so that we all have somebody to laugh at.

                    I totally disagree with that comment. I can't even believe you said it. I do hope you were only joking and even so it would have been a joke of bad taste.

                    How can you disagree with that comment, if they were able to work their way to the top
                    we wouldn't be having this conversation now would we.

                    Bad taste - come come, some like curry and some don't, doesn't mean that curry is "in bad taste" We all have the right to our views - you know "Freedom of speech" that teeny weeny little thing that everybody talks about when they say what they want but forgets about when they don't like what others have to say.

                    It's really fun to watch the BEE's manage companies into the ground. Its like watching a destruction derby, crash boom bam...Damn, it's like a Chuck Norris movie, you know he's gonna destroy everything in the end but you watch with morbid facination anyway. At least my little company doesn't suffer from BEE as I only employ foreigners. My German and Zimbabwean employees work 10x as hard as the lazy locals. They earn fat performance based salaries. I could of course get my BEE status right up there if I made the gardener an equal partner, but he is South Afican so he'll just be a "Sleeping" partner anyway...

                    Comment

                    • flaker
                      Silver Member

                      • May 2010
                      • 419

                      #11
                      lets stop throwing stones

                      It's really fun to watch the BEE's manage companies into the ground.quoting Adriaan.

                      Come on guys it can't be fun & i know it was no fun when PW managed our country South Africa into the ground. Remember that rubicon speech in Durban. Our currency crashed,the stock exchange closed for a few dayswe're now paying more rands for one dollar when previously we got dollars for one rand!Who was this PW.?Who voted him there?

                      Comment

                      • adrianh
                        Diamond Member

                        • Mar 2010
                        • 6328

                        #12
                        It is great fun, watching senior technicians get skopped out of ESKOM to be replaced with young BEE women, senior jet aircraft mechanics leave the air force to be replaced with you know who, etc. We just love the "space creation packages" they are so good for the country - you know, letting senior technincians with 35 years experience go on early retirement. It's also cool to watch the young railway control centre operator take the wrong action when a certain green train ran away. Like I said, its a demolition derby, we crack open a six pack, sit back and watch the comedy unfold. Now the question is this; what have I got to lose through all of this - nothing much really, I am already poor, so it doesn't matter to me one way or another.

                        I watched a family member with 4 degrees and 25 years experience in a bank be sidelined for a very senior position. The position was filled by a 29 year old BEE who managed all by himself p1$$ the entire management team off so badly that they all left over a period of 2 years. The family member attained a higher position at another establishment only to have the same Mr BEE come for a job interview...Luckily, due to his stunning track record, he failed to get a job, not even as a teller, where he should have been placed in the first place. What the BEE's fail to understand that an MBA cannot replace years of hands on experience. Reading a book about management and then being installed as a manager is like reading a book about golf and then going to play on Tiger Woods's behalf - it simply doesn't work!

                        Yes PW, what a character, the Rubicon speech was really not so clever. He did cause havoc that day. And the value of the rand, tough one that, considering that the goverment is keeping the rand and its current level. But you know, if we talk about the stupid things that PW said then we can also talk about the stupid things JZ does and also the stupid things that old Julius says. I am glad to see that JZ has gotten ol Julius to keep quiet for a bit, I think the guy got the spaking of his life, much worse that the spanknig he got for failing woodwork.

                        To get back to where this conversation started - work your way to the top and you have my respect, get plugged in to the top because of a BEE quota and you are on your own. (for me and others to have a good chuckle at your expense)

                        Comment

                        • murdock
                          Suspended

                          • Oct 2007
                          • 2346

                          #13
                          the bottom line...my sister was paid out a small package and replaced with a BBEE person...now she has lost all the benefits to the other person...like pension medical aid etc etc etc...she is now working in the same position as a contractor without the benefits...but teaching the replacement...to do her job she has been doing for 20 years but without the benefits of a housing subsidy etc...thats the big picture everyone seems to be missing...

                          and as someone else mentioned...dont run away...well i am not gona say what i would like to...not everyone can find work...especially if you are white...all i have to do is get my british passport like the rest of my family and move to a country where i will be able to get one important thing and thats a pension as i get older...i just need to spend 2 years there and i will qualify...i cant see this country offering pensions for too many years...what will you do then? at this stage of my life i can go anywhere do anything...put up with the contracts being taken away etc...but what will happen when i need to retire?

                          Comment

                          • E-Deposit
                            Email problem
                            • Jul 2010
                            • 8

                            #14
                            German Woman

                            My German and Zimbabwean employees work 10x as hard as the lazy locals. They earn fat performance based salaries. I could of course get my BEE status right up there if I made the gardener an equal partner, but he is South Afican so he'll just be a "Sleeping" partner anyway...
                            Well my home language is german but I guess that doesnt matter then 'cus I'm a local ... AND I'm a woman hey?
                            Last edited by Dave A; 02-Aug-10, 07:54 PM.

                            Comment

                            • adrianh
                              Diamond Member

                              • Mar 2010
                              • 6328

                              #15
                              Ok, I'll admit, I'm not really a tyrant. The German person that works with me is a brilliant 28 year old female graphic designer. My wife is my partner in the business. The wife does all the book keeping n stuff and I look after the technical side. I have 3 Zimbabweans working with me, 1 x white male, 1 x black male & 1 x black female. We all work our butts off and we all get along very well. My two daughters are real little entreprenuers because they spend a lot of time with us in the workshop, talking business & trading on Bid Or Buy & Ebay. We are teaching the girls to have the same attitude as you: To be strong, indepenent, well educated and not to rely on a boyfriend or husband to make their way through life.

                              I believe some of the things I said are true, some not, and a lot is said simply to wind people up. We take ourselves far too seriously. :-)

                              Comment

                              Working...