where is the line?

[Dave A]

With all this lousy outside wiring on a plug top, they sure must get a lot of nuisance tripping when it rains.

he mentioned that the new owner that he shouldnt switch on the one circuit breaker which was down because there is a fault on the circuit.

Sometime I think the electrical industry gets too focused on just compliance issues.

If the fault isn't a compliance issue; if it's a maintenance issue, risk and benefit commonly pass with occupation. It is entirely possible the seller is responsible for the repair required -especially as the seller was clearly aware of the problem.

[AndyD]

let me try understand this statement...so you saying working on a fibreglass ladder is not always the brightest solutions...

If you're going to grab the live and neutral simultaneously then a fibreglass ladder will stop the earth leakage from tripping.

There was a thread a while ago where I questioned exactly how effective earth-leakage breakers were at saving lives. This is one scenario where they wouldn't save your life.

[murdock]

If you're going to grab the live and neutral simultaneously then a fibreglass ladder will stop the earth leakage from tripping.

There was a thread a while ago where I questioned exactly how effective earth-leakage breakers were at saving lives. This is one scenario where they wouldn't save your life.

just thinking off the top of my head (which i seem to do more than not ) wouldnt it be better to use a steel ladder which is earthed?

and after making that statement this could be a problem if there is no earth leakage baecause you would be the closest path to earth

[daveob]

just thinking off the top of my head (which i seem to do more than not ) wouldnt it be better to use a steel ladder which is earthed?

I got a steel ladder - it has thick rubber feet on all the legs to stop it from slipping - so I suppose that's defeating the purpose of the steel ladder ?

[AndyD]

Coming into contact with the L + N simultaneously whilst being completely insulated from earth isn't a very likely scenario, it could happen but it shouldn't. If you do then it means you didn't isolate and test the circuit before working on it which is your own stupidity as an electrician or even as a house owner. If a customer comes into contact with the power then there was something non-compliant about the installation which is their responsibility.....unless it was made that way by a qualified electrician and signed off.

Electricity, as with gas or refrigeration will always have the potential to kill or injure no matter how it's installed, that's just the nature of the beast.

[adrianh]

Coming into contact with the L + N simultaneously whilst being completely insulated from earth isn't a very likely scenario

What about things like bedside lamps that are only wired with flex?

[AndyD]

What about things like bedside lamps that are only wired with flex?

I don't understand the question. Any lamps which have a metal body should be earthed via a 3-wire flex and 3-pin plug. There should be no physical way to come into contact with the live and neutral wiring on any lamp.

[Justloadit]

What about things like bedside lamps that are only wired with flex?

THESE are usually imported cheap nasty devices. According to SANAS/SABS, all equipment which has metal must be earthed, clearly the twin flex fails.

Anyway any new electrical equipment now imported into RSA, requires a SABS certificate , or it will not be released by customs.

[adrianh]

Don't know about that. I have a metal SABS approved Eurolux lamp clamped to my desk that has a 2 pin plug. I bought the lamp about 6 months ago.

[Dave A]

Coming into contact with the L + N simultaneously whilst being completely insulated from earth isn't a very likely scenario, it could happen but it shouldn't.

I agree - you just can't cover for every eventuality, especially those who are trying to win the Darwin Awards

[AndyD]

You can't regulate to cover that kinda stupidity

She should at least pierce her tongue and get a 5mm stud so a decent trailing earth strap could be installed on to it by the next electrical contractor who sees her doing that. Anyway looking on the bright side, unless she nail-guns her head to the wall she wouldn't be considered a fixed appliance so she wouldn't be part of a COC.

[Dave A]

There's just no justice in this world.

Once she's zapped, she'll probably fall down and break contact.

Which is what is likely to happen if you're hooked up while standing on a ladder,
which is also what is likely to happen to the oke who grabs both conductors while wearing insulated shoes so that he doesn't trip the earth leakage.

Of course some people just have no luck at all. In which case I suggest you follow them around with a video camera. You should get lots of good material to post on Youtube.

[murdock]

having sleepless nights dave?

[Dave A]

Went to bed too early and went badoing in the middle of the night