NWO has SA in its sights. (part 1)

[Trickzta]

Who writes this garbage?

Dave that’s the most intelligent question posed to date, on this entire thread. (my opinion) Thank you. Disregarding the filth referred to above, that provocative post was a blog, one of many on the net.
Not a reliable source but a real (or not?) sad reflection of our society. There were horribly graphic, downright racist (extreme) propaganda and violence inciting rhetorical posts.
The one I posted had similar elements, plus swearing, but was less radical than most. It was on SA News Today. Not exactly the nation building scenario we need right now.
Taunting Malema is playing to his hand. (is this orchestrated to foster racial tension?) This is not farfetched in the least. It is not proven to be such, but I wonder. Malema enjoys support (for now) from very powerful people, including financial support and psyop propaganda. (Opinion)
The following link (source; UK Independent News) gives us a viewpoint of “history” from an African point of view and a bit of the bigger picture. It’s all about gold, uranium and fossil fuel deposits.
Inside France's secret war
For 40 years, the French government has been fighting a secret war in Africa, hidden not only from its people, but from the world. It has led the French to slaughter democrats, install dictator after dictator – and to fund and fuel the most vicious genocide since the Nazis. Today, this war is so violent that thousands are fleeing across the border from the Central African Republic into Darfur – seeking sanctuary in the world's most notorious killing fields http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...ar-396062.html

[Dave A]

Not a reliable source

Agreed.

but a real (or not?) sad reflection of our society.

Now hold on a bit there. I thought the basic premise here is these are stories that are not mainstream thinking.
(And they're clearly not).

So how do you stretch this to a "reflection of our society"?
It's a reflection of something alright, but certainly not society in general.

My next question was going to be "so what are they trying to achieve?", but given that you don't know who these people are, or what their agenda is, let's skip that one for now. And rather ask -

So what are you trying to achieve in posting all this stuff here?

[Trickzta]

Thanks again Dave, valid questions, it’s always a pleasure to respond to genuine questions.

As to the reflection question I would use this example to make the point I had in mind. In a law firm of a dozen lawyers, the criminal or unethical behaviour of an individual is said to bring the Company into disrepute. The actions of one member reflects badly on the others or put in another way is a bad reflection on the Company.

I hope that answers your question adequately Dave. A better way of expressing myself would have been to say that ‘this reflects badly on our society’ or words to that effect. My aim was not to taint everyone with the same brush.

Your second question requires more explanation. Bear in mind that the following statements are a penciled in ‘basic plan’ much of which would be subject to the direction taken by the hoped for discussion. Flexibility was an open option at any juncture. So my aims are loosely defined and not rigidly set in any way.

One of my aims was to get past the point where mocking, insulting and other counter-productive measures are the order of the day.

I’m not squealing, just replying to a question. There is a difference between ‘banter’ which I enjoy and ‘taunting” which I try to handle calmly.

A genuine exchange of beliefs, knowledge and experience would, at this stage, be first prize. BTW, Dave, I know that I still need to reply to a question of yours, relating to my previous disastrous attempt to engage in discussion. I haven’t forgotten, but at the time that thread had gone pear shaped and I engaged in a ‘tactical retreat’.

Note; the mocking etc., that I refer to above, is not of a serious nor malicious nature. It is non-productive and disruptive at times, but it is tolerable and understandable. This is not an official complaint, merely an observation.

This thread is pear shaped too. I’m working on the theory that things can only get better. Let’s hope that our exchange improves matters considerably. I’ll post more about my original intentions shortly.

[HR Solutions]

I’ll post more about my original intentions shortly

Your "intentions" might not necessary be what other people on this forum believe or even consider. I have read a bit of what has been said on this thread. I have not looked at any link, because postings on links are posted by some persons and are not necessary factual. They are what other people believe or their "intentions". It has seemed that whenever someone has said something not agreeing with you, a sarcastic comment has been forthcoming. You have apologized on numerous occasions for what or how you have said something. You have also agreed that this thread is "pear" shaped. My theory is that this thread will not get better because of difference of opinions of which some people including yourself cannot accept. My opinion is that there will always be conspiracy theories. Yes the CIA has been known to play dirty etc etc, but some of the things that you have mentioned before relating closer to home is utter crap, and I repeat "some". Please do remember that a lot of people have hands on knowledge and experience over the years in certain military operations / government operations and will not always argue these points with you due to obvious reason. There are many different people on this forum and around from many different walks of life and you would be quite surprised what some of them have done over the years.

[Trickzta]

In Part One, my original intention was to cover Africa as whole, and to expose the way in which through fair means or foul, African countries are continuously prevented from achieving true or total independence, and through International Agencies and Financial Institutions are pressured, by various means, into supplying cheap labour to allow Foreign Investors maximum profits (which are huge).

Leaders that do not fall in line with the wishes of some these Investors are severely dealt with. Obey or pay a terrible price is the offer. With rich rewards for those that obey and terrible consequences for those that don’t – It’s not a choice really, more like a death threat. Support us or die.

Also, and here I’m being totally honest, Malema makes more sense than most, in summing up the situation, in which we find ourselves. (Of course it’s not genuine concern, but it is an accurate assessment of the situation at grassroots level)

However, while recognizing the ‘reality’ of the situation, Malema has no solid workable solution, or rather he has not presented such a solution. Fancy slogans and empty promises will once again raise the hopes and aspirations of the oppressed masses, resulting in a euphoric and loyal group of fanatical supporters, a group which will once again be forgotten after the vote rigging is over.

Once the domination of African countries and ‘elected’ governments, and the exploitation of Africa’s natural resources on a mind boggling scale, is established as still being in existence, then Part Two would have been initiated.

[vieome]

Who writes this garbage?

Worse are those who believe the Garbage!

[HR Solutions]

In Part One, my original intention was to cover Africa as whole

But you haven't - you have generalised everything and your scope went way beyond "Africa" !
You never reply back to people except to give them a sharp response. You go on and on "quoting" things which is only what other people have thought or believe which is pure fiction.

EG. As far as I am concerned we HAVE landed on the moon when the footage was taken, unless PROVEN otherwise. Peoples "theories" or written "theories" is not proof of anything !

[Dave A]

Thanks for the insight into your line of thinking, Trickzta. It certainly helps to understand where you're really coming from.

And if I may say so, more credible and persuasive than the vast majority of your "copy and paste" excerpts that have made up so much of your posting here so far. (pmbguy has already covered the fundamental problem with this, so I won't repeat the dose here).

In Part One, my original intention was to cover Africa as whole, and to expose the way in which through fair means or foul, African countries are continuously prevented from achieving true or total independence, and through International Agencies and Financial Institutions are pressured, by various means, into supplying cheap labour to allow Foreign Investors maximum profits (which are huge).

Leaders that do not fall in line with the wishes of some these Investors are severely dealt with. Obey or pay a terrible price is the offer. With rich rewards for those that obey and terrible consequences for those that don’t – It’s not a choice really, more like a death threat. Support us or die.

We actually share a common interest, or perhaps that should be a common frustration - the failure of Africa to realise its enormous potential. I do, however, see the cause of the problem in a rather different way.

I suggest Africa's failure to realise its potential is not as a result of external influences, but because of failures from within.

Sure, there are external influences that have led some of Africa's leadership astray via temptation, but those questionable external influences make up an extreme minority compared to the deluge of support we would get if we "cleaned up our own act" and stopped shooting ourselves in the foot.

The chief failing of our leadership, and I suggest the number one contributor to Africa's poor performance, must surely be the pursuit of power for the purpose of self-enrichment, rather than to be of service and build the community(ies) these leaders lead. The purpose of pursuing power in Africa is so often not as a result of a sense of duty to the people who raise you aloft, but as a means to acquire personal wealth. Upliftment of the lot of your supporters is secondary. And any benefit that your competition might derive from your efforts is a definite no-no; they must be crushed and subjugated for failing to win the throne of power, to ensure that they may never reach the top spot and in turn treat you as you have treated them.

Why else does Mugabe not retire? Is there really no-one fit to replace him? Is living out the rest of his days in comfortable retirement really such a bad thing?

Why else do we see such conflict in CAR, Southern Sudan and other hotspots on the continent?

And what of South Africa and the situation we find ourselves in?
You see a planned assault by a shadowy NWO.
I see individual opportunists in it for themselves.

These opportunists take advantage of the leaders with weak ethics who put their self interest ahead of their duty - that when temptation was laid before them by a corporate (or individuals within that corporate) in the arms deal, they did not say "no", and took the bribe. It proved to be the thin end of the wedge, and the rest, as they say, is history.

No global NWO conspiracy here - just an offer made and accepted for personal gain, and suitably candy coated to ease the consciences of the guilty and ensure acceptance by the people.

[tec0]

Africa is a mathematical certainty when it comes to failure. Again no conspiracy all you have to do is to follow the amount of money that goes into Africa and the amount of resources that goes out of Africa.

The truth is a no-brainer but the question is; was it by design? Simple answer is the measure of wealth. Who is making money and who is losing money.

So how does the NWO fit into all of this? Well consider first who those individuals are then consider who applied the pressure in local affairs then you have a clear picture that Africa is exactly what the outside world wants it to be...

That is why we haven’t seen any significant improvement in the last 100 years or so...

[pmbguy]

That is why we haven’t seen any significant improvement in the last 100 years or so...

...not so sure about that. Lets take life expectancy and the child mortality rate 100years ago and compare it to now. Life was really short 100y ago. So the continent and its people have benefited from colonial/post-colonial development, just not nearly as much as other continents. If Sub-Saharan Africa was not developed by Europeans it would have seen no development at all. Africa had to catch up on millenniums of development in a relatively short period. It’s natural that Africa is how it is, so far behind. This combined with corruption from within Africa and from without, Makes Africa an easy target for economic manipulation and exploitation.

Africa is an old world and there is no order, no new world order needed.

[Trickzta]

Thanks for the kind words Dave.
There is indeed common ground (and common goals) in the way that we see the African team losing sight of reality, resulting in corruption and self enrichment to the detriment of the poor and of the country as a whole. I feel that in our own way, we are both correct. The biggest difference, in this case anyway, is as you’ve already said, I tend to blame outside interests and you tend to blame inside interests. We both concede that inside and outside influences do exist, we differ on which influence is the most dominant. Sound right to you so far?

The actual reality, in my opinion, is that this is a rather complex issue, due to the many other influencing factors, of a lesser magnitude than the two on which we are basing our viewpoints on. Added to the mix is the probability that these influences could be in a constant state of flux. The influences themselves could vary in magnitude from day to day (and from person to person).

For clarity it would be wise to ignore the more complex, and in this case, the less significant array of factors unless they have a direct bearing on the case or are used to reinforce a valid point.

Ooopsy, I’m jumping the gun a little here, by assuming that you would be prepared to engage in a short debate, the object not being to assert our opinions but rather to get an understanding of each other’s views. Would you mind if we did this exercise Dave? A brief exchange of ideas and then move on to another topic. No winners or losers, and all that stuff.

I‘ll use examples at times to get my point across more clearly. I’ll start the discussion tomorrow if you agree to it, and have the time for it. No hard feelings if you are tied up or time strapped or just reluctant.

In my opinion and in my own words, I feel that our brainwashing starts soon after we start crawling. Mind programming is a better way of putting it. Skip to an example later in childhood. Mom shouts “Johnny what are you doing on top of the wall? Come down right now before you fall off.” Mom, genuinely concerned about Johnny has planted some seeds that may or may not influence Johnny’s future behaviour in respect of walking on the top of walls.

Put a 4 X 4 length of plank on the ground and I’ll walk up and down the plank with ease. Raise the plank 5 metres off the ground and I’m unable to put one foot forward. Balance becomes an issue, this is a mental trick that your mind plays on you. Mom’s ….”before you fall off” comment is subconsciously at work, and even though you walked the plank (so to speak) with ease when it was on the ground, without once wobbling or doubting your ability, the raised plank presents a problem.

A problem that is not of your own making, but a problem no less. Continuous exposure to propaganda may or may not have a similar effect on your mind. Children (people) do not react in the same way to different circumstances as others do, sometimes a child acts differently to the same set of circumstances, on separate occasions. We are unique beings, whose uniqueness is presented in modern day terms as deviant in some cases (a strong-willed child not conforming to accepted norms without intervention).

Unique is bad, conform is good. Schools/teachers take over from Mom and Johnny’s programming shifts up a gear. Stand in a straight line, don’t talk or chew gum. Walk in single file, put your hand in the air if you would want to speak. Put your hand in the air and when teacher gives you the nod, only then you may speak. Don’t move until the bell rings. And so on.

I’m not against maintaining order and discipline at schools. Not at all. I’m using this as an example, of how the mind is instrumental in determining (to a degree) and forging young minds to conform to pre-determined parameters, sometimes to the detriment of the child, but necessary to ensure an easy passage and acceptance into society.

There are many things in this presentation that are debatable, have big gaps or are incomplete etc., I know it is much more complex and intricate than stated here, but the debate is centered around African Politics, and for that purpose, general explanations need not be scrutinized, unless it is necessary to contest or make a valid point.

Dave, I’m trying to set a precedent that will see any future discussion proceeding smoothly, without chasing off at a tangent over a minor detail not related to the topic and excluding squabbling over irrelevant points that tend to be an utter waste of time. This is new to me! An actual conversation!

This is superfluous to you, as I’ve noticed you are direct and to the point in your posts. You manage to communicate clearly, keeping your words to a minimum without sacrificing content nor intent.

Then there’s myself that writes a book to get a small point across (and fails!). I’ll get the hang of it in no time. It’s just that somebody has lifted my plank and I’m on shaky ground.

Last night I was allowed to use the Wife’s PC (windows 8) I am not supposed to even open the internet for two main reasons, some sites I chance across have virus collections that they share freely, and generously. And not being fluent in bits, bytes, gigs and all, I manage to merge spreadsheets with emails and adverts (or even worse).

I typed my replies and when no-one was looking I emailed the Word Doc to my gmail account. Thinking that I could open the Word Doc on my PC at work and then copy it to the forum and Bob’s my Aunty. I couldn’t even open the Doc. This doesn’t even resemble the original. This PC is Excel or something like that. The problem is that the two PC’s do combat. (not combatable, darn things!)

[Trickzta]

Worse are those who believe the Garbage!

You have hit the nail on the head. The poor souls who believe the Garbage have my sympathy.

[Dave A]

The actual reality, in my opinion, is that this is a rather complex issue, due to the many other influencing factors,

Just one factor explains so much of it - human nature.
(Which is indeed complex at times ).

Ooopsy, I’m jumping the gun a little here, by assuming that you would be prepared to engage in a short debate, the object not being to assert our opinions but rather to get an understanding of each other’s views. Would you mind if we did this exercise Dave? A brief exchange of ideas and then move on to another topic. No winners or losers, and all that stuff.

I‘ll use examples at times to get my point across more clearly. I’ll start the discussion tomorrow if you agree to it, and have the time for it. No hard feelings if you are tied up or time strapped or just reluctant.

Why limit it to just the two of us. It's a free forum where everyone can join the debate...

Look, by all means make your points and supporting arguments - that's the whole idea here.

I'll read them when I can, and if I feel I can contribute something to the discussion that might be worthwhile , and time permits, I'll respond (sometimes that's only eventually though) with as much careful consideration as I can muster.

About as much of an undertaking as I can give, I'm afraid.

[iLLuDeano]

http://mg.co.za/article/2014-01-16-motsoaledi-big-pharmas-satanic-plot-is-genocide

""Health Minister Aaron Motsoaledi has accused a group of multinational pharmaceutical companies active in South Africa of conspiring against the state, the people of South Africa and the populations of developing countries – and of planning what amounts to mass murder.

"I am not using strong words; I am using appropriate words. This is genocide," Motsoaledi told the Mail & Guardian on Thursday, in response to a plan he described as a conspiracy of "satanic magnitude" – a plan he called on all South Africans to fight "to the last drop of their blood".""

Read The full article guys!!

[pmbguy]

So by posting it here and not on a new thread I can assume that you see big bad pharma as evidence of a NWO. It seems that almost anything is evidence of the NWO. What a waste of a good post, it could have been discussed so much more constructively for what it is without being seen through NWO spectacles.