Saturday at home, installing an inverter

[AndyD]

In your post you mentioned that a system like your's will cost more or less in the same price range. I received a quote for Axpert 3KVA unit with 4 trojan batteries including installation for R50000. The Axpert unit was quoted R17000 and the batteries (Trojan deep cycle cells) R20000 (R5000x4). This is beyond my budget at the moment.

The prices are very high, I can only suggest you get some more quotes. There was a brand new Axpert 3KW inverter being sold here which is sold now but it should give you an indication of the ballpark price you should be looking at. I charge customers around R2200.00 each for the Trojan 6v deep cycle batteries I'm not sure why you're getting quoted R5K each unless they're a much higher specification battery.

Are you able to suggest any reliable units as well as batteries that can bring down the costs involved. I came across Maximus batteries which were quoted R1500 but I am not sure how reliable they are or the life expectancy for the same.

I'm not familiar with the Maximus batteres but I think your original spec with the Axpert inverter and Trojan batteries was probably spot on, like I say I'd do some more investigating for better prices if I were you.

I am currently faced an occasional 1 or 2 hour long power cut. Hence after going through another post from you I was also considering voltronic unit 2kva to start off with and add another one as time goes by depending on my requirement. however I am unable to get any information on the particular unit or its price. I am also wondering if it would be a very expensive exercise to add more units.

Voltronic are the Taiwanese company that produce the Axpert range of inverters mentioned above. I'm not really understanding your question here. Some of the Axpert inverters are scaleable whereby you can connect two of them together and they produce a single output that's double the power of a single inverter. Not all are capable of this so you need to read the specs of the different models.

[blackknight72]

Thank you very much for your prompt response.

I shall certainly investigate around the prices. I was under the impression that Voltronic was a different brand which is more expensive than Axpert. Do you by any chance happen to sell any of these inverters?

I am just wondering if it would be possible for me to buy the batteries from you. I am not certain how much it will cost to courier them to East London.

[bergie]

those prices are very expensive . i sell the 5kva axpert for cheaper than the 3kva you have being quoted on. i install as well. i use the bosch 105AH 12 volt batteries. 4 in series.
the 5kva model can be paralleled up to 6 inverters and has a built in powerful mppt solar charger.
i am however looking for enclosed battery cases for 4 batteries. i have been making my own.

Thank you very much for your prompt response.

I shall certainly investigate around the prices. I was under the impression that Voltronic was a different brand which is more expensive than Axpert. Do you by any chance happen to sell any of these inverters?

I am just wondering if it would be possible for me to buy the batteries from you. I am not certain how much it will cost to courier them to East London.

[AndyD]

I was under the impression that Voltronic was a different brand which is more expensive than Axpert.

I'm wondering if you're getting confused with 'Victronic' who are better known nowadays as 'Victron'.

Victron are a superior product in my humble opinion, if you look at the multiplus range and compare the raw specifications with other makes of inverter you'll see what I mean. Unfortunately they're considerably more expensive which often makes them a hard sell in the domestic and small business market even though you do get what you pay for.

The Voltronic website is here http://www.voltronicpower.com/ . If you look under the 'Inverter & AVR' menu you'll see the Axpert ranges.

Do you by any chance happen to sell any of these inverters?

We're primarily designing and installing complete systems but if you send me a PM with your requirements including model number I'll happily give you a quote for supply only. If you're unsure which model suits your requirements I'll try to help you find the best option.

I am just wondering if it would be possible for me to buy the batteries from you. I am not certain how much it will cost to courier them to East London.

Again I'll happily give you a quote if you give me the specifics of your preferred batteries ie voltage, cycle rating and capacity in Ah etc. If you have your own courier I'll liase with them otherwise I'll investigate transport options from my side and you'd just pay whatever costs are incurred.

[blackknight72]

I'm wondering if you're getting confused with 'Victronic' who are better known nowadays as 'Victron'.

Victron are a superior product in my humble opinion, if you look at the multiplus range and compare the raw specifications with other makes of inverter you'll see what I mean. Unfortunately they're considerably more expensive which often makes them a hard sell in the domestic and small business market even though you do get what you pay for.

The Voltronic website is here http://www.voltronicpower.com/ . If you look under the 'Inverter & AVR' menu you'll see the Axpert ranges.



We're primarily designing and installing complete systems but if you send me a PM with your requirements including model number I'll happily give you a quote for supply only. If you're unsure which model suits your requirements I'll try to help you find the best option.


Again I'll happily give you a quote if you give me the specifics of your preferred batteries ie voltage, cycle rating and capacity in Ah etc. If you have your own courier I'll liase with them otherwise I'll investigate transport options from my side and you'd just pay whatever costs are incurred.

Thank you Andy! I will check the facts once again with the installer and see if he willing to provide another quote. If he sticks to the same quote I shall get the units and batteries from you. I will have to find someone who is willing to do the installation for me in that case.

Indeed I was confused between the brands victron and voltronic. I was referring to Victron.

I would like your opinion on my judgment regarding a 3KW inverter based on my needs.

My requirements are the following

Led down lights ( all dimmable 5w) 20 units
TV+ dstv
Inkjet printer
refrigerator 300W
Motor for garage door
CFL 6x10W

Do you think 3KW would be an overkill in this scenario?

Thank you!

[blackknight72]

those prices are very expensive . i sell the 5kva axpert for cheaper than the 3kva you have being quoted on. i install as well. i use the bosch 105AH 12 volt batteries. 4 in series.
the 5kva model can be paralleled up to 6 inverters and has a built in powerful mppt solar charger.
i am however looking for enclosed battery cases for 4 batteries. i have been making my own.

Thank you bergie,please see my response below.

[blackknight72]

Thank you bergie,please see my response below.

Thank you for your feedback. I received another quote today from yet another installer, R34000 for installing a 1KW system ( includes 4 trojan 240Ah batteries and 1KW inverter)This simply highlights the value of forums like this and inputs given by people like yourself when it comes to taking an informed decision. Certainly inverter installation in this part of the country is a lucrative business.

[AndyD]

Indeed I was confused between the brands victron and voltronic. I was referring to Victron.

Lol, I had a sneaky feeling you were. I've installed Victron units as far back as 6 or 7 years ago in the marine sector and we've never had a failure to date. I rate them very highly but alas they're often outside of the budget.

I would like your opinion on my judgment regarding a 3KW inverter based on my needs.

My requirements are the following

Led down lights ( all dimmable 5w) 20 units
TV+ dstv
Inkjet printer
refrigerator 300W
Motor for garage door
CFL 6x10W

Do you think 3KW would be an overkill in this scenario?

When establishing your load requirements there's no substitute for using an RMS clamp meter to actually test the current draw of each appliance whilst it's running. It also helps if the clamp meter has a maximum hold facility which retains the maximum current draw over a period of time. We always check the real-life power requirements before specifying an inverter, the difference between the current stated on the appliance and the actual current draw as measured in real life can be as much as 50%. Make yourself up a test lead as shown below and use it to supply each appliance in turn whilst you perform load current tests. If you don't have a clamp meter it's well worth begging, borrowing, stealing or buying one.



You may also be able to apply some sensible 'diversity', for example it's highly unlikely you'd be opening the garage door at the precise time you're printing a document. On the other side of things it's possible that your fridge which is a motor load could have a momentary start current of maybe 1.5KW just for a fraction of a second when the compressor starts running.

[bergie]

a calculated guess. at least a 2 kw . 3kw if you can afford it . i wouldnt recommend a 1kw at all. if you run these inverters full load all the time it wont last long.
i will be getting a shipment of 5 kva 22 amp axpert inverters in a few weeks. it will be very reasonably priced.

[Justloadit]

I have just the instrument to measure power with the necessary plug and socket

I also have a plug attachment to connect a bayonet socket and a E28 socket, so that you can show the consumption of a incandescent lamp against a LED lamp.

My dealer price is R1,650.00 excluding VAT from my office.

[Justloadit]

Here a picture of it for those not too interested in reading the brochure

[AndyD]

...........i wouldnt recommend a 1kw at all. if you run these inverters full load all the time it wont last long.........

This was one of the reasons I installed this unit in my home office, I wanted to put it under a test regime before I offered them as an option to customers. I've performed a series of marginal and substantial overload tests under varying ambient temperatures on it whilst monitoring internal component temperatures to see how it performed. I've run it under highly inductive and highly capacitive loads and I've also run some controlled short circuit tests to check disconnect times of OCPD's etc and fault current handling abilities of the output components and internal safety systems.

[bergie]

andy, is it the 1kw axpert inverter you are testing? for blacknights purposes it probably would be under rated

[AndyD]

It's the 3kW unit same as Blacknight was looking at for his installation.

[IMHO]

Andy, need your help!

As you know I run a guesthouse and I am looking at getting away slowly from Eskom. I am changing my geysers to gas as they pack-up. Done two so far, plenty to go. Stove is gas now as well. The next area I need to tackle is my laundry. I used the clamp tester method as you showed and here is the results. I would love to put the laundry on solar. I use the tumble dryers a lot, as it is the only way to get our towels soft. The washing machines also work hard. Ironing is 3 irons for about 2 hours a day, but lets work on 4 hours a day.

Appliance Iron x 3
H/day 4 hours
Amps peak 7.8A
Amps normal 0
They switch on and off, so it is either peak or off, They switch on for a minute or two to get to temp and then switch on and of every few seconds, say 30sec intervals.

Appliance Tumble Dryer1 (10kg)
H/day 4 hours
Amps peak 13A on switch on
Amps normal settles to under 8A
Peak at 13 amp very short. Then stays on 7.8A about for the duration.

Appliance Tumble Dryer2 (5kg)
H/day 2 hours but very seldom uses it. Just on very rare occasions.
Amps peak A on switch on
Amps normal settles to under A
Peak at amp very short. Then stays on A about for the duration.

Appliance Washing Machine Whirlpool
H/day 4 hours (actual 3 but work on 4)
Amps peak 5A on spin
Amps normal settles to under 3A

Appliance SpeedQueen
H/day 4 hours (actual 3 but work on 4)
Amps peak 8A on spin
Amps normal settles to under 5A

My aim would be to get these appliances completely off grid, with solar. So I need to know the inverter size and specs, batt capacity and solar panels to do the charging. Rainy or cloudy days, I will have to revert back to Eskom. Or will it be cost effective to have battery capacity to last 4 days? I would also need something to tell me what capacity is left. (Like a petrol gauge, hehe)